A question to the EK experts! Who can tell me more about this minature EK?
15 mm diameter, enamelled, screwback.
15 mm diameter, enamelled, screwback.
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Last edited by Sergeant 08; 05-12-2009, 02:57 AM. -
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EK miniature for a buttonhole on civil clothes?Last edited by Sergeant 08; 05-12-2009, 06:23 AM.Comment
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When manufactured? Thanks for help, thoughts and informations!
Last edited by Sergeant 08; 05-12-2009, 06:59 AM.Comment
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Why would someone make a mini of the REVERSE of a cross, be it 1813, 1870 or 1914?
Regards
MikeRegards
Mike
Evaluate the item, not the story and not the seller's reputation!
If you PM/contact me without the courtesy of using your first name, please don't be offended if I politely ignore you!Comment
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For the 1813 it is easy to answer. It was the first pattern and this side was more impressive and decorative than the other one. The symbol (EK 1813 reverse) was used for a lot of patriotic items (book covers etc.) in the 19th century.Originally posted by Mike Kenny View Post
I think it is only a kind of small patriotic cross. Perhaps Kriegerverein?Last edited by Sergeant 08; 05-12-2009, 07:59 AM.Comment
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Remember--miniatures were all unoffical. So anythig is possible. That
being said, Mike brings up a very ggod point. That should be the back
of the cross.
I have never NEVER seen a 1813 miniature before. In person, on the
forum or in books.
Screwback minis are very uncommon from any period. This one is also
vaulted and enameled. This one has just TOO much going for it. I think
this is a modern fake. A very well done fake but still a fake.Comment
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I thought it could be a kind of patriotic stuff. Made after 1900 for example for members of patriotic organizations or in memory of the war in 1813 (Centenar celebrations, 100 years after the war).
I have never thought it could be a real miniature for military veterans, that fought in war in 1813.
Last edited by Sergeant 08; 05-12-2009, 08:01 AM.Comment
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Don't forget, after a certain date (someone will add it as I am at work and without my reference books, but I'd think in the 1830s), it was officially permitted by royal decree to wear the 1813 EK2 in reverse to show the oak leaf/cipher/date design outwards. Near everyone did it, even the King Of Prussia who instituted the award, Frederick William III. His uniforms in museums show the EK2 being worn "backwards."Originally posted by Mike Kenny View Post
That's not to say that this one is real, just to say that the fact that the reverse design is on the front doesn't really mean anything except as a possible means of dating it.
~Trevor
EDIT: Royal decree of 19 April 1838 allowed the 1813 EK2 to be worn backwards.Last edited by streptile; 05-13-2009, 08:43 PM.Best regards,
Streptile
Looking for ROUND BUTTON 1939 EK1 Spange cases (LDO or PKZ)Comment
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Thanks for the informations, Trevor
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Very interesting...........
The screwback disc knob suggests a strong resemblence to a modified disc seen on Hansen 1914 EKI screwbacks.
Trevor is correct that the statute for wearing an 1813 second class with the original reverse as the obverse was done to coincide with how the awardees chose to wear their esteemed award. The reverse was much more attractive than the plain flat obverse.
Given that the 1813 EKI did not have a reverse design and that so few of the 1st class EKs were awarded I think that this minature actually represents an 1813 EKII for wear on civilian clothes.
The construction and quality of this minature suggests a much later time frame. 1870's thru the Jubilee era, would be my guess.
Just some thoughts,
TonyAn opinion should be the result of thought, not a substitute for it.
"First ponder, then dare." von MoltkeComment
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Hi Tony,Originally posted by Tiger 1 View Post
I hadn't thought of that, but it makes sense. How big could the market for a lapel-pin 1813 EK1 have possibly been? And if they were manufactured, they'd likely have plain fronts, as the design shown here was unknown on EK1s.
TrevorBest regards,
Streptile
Looking for ROUND BUTTON 1939 EK1 Spange cases (LDO or PKZ)Comment
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Now I got it! I'm not familar with EK miniatures, but I had a lot of old stuff in my hands during last years. I can say I have a good feeling about it. The most Imperial items had a very good quality. Remember, this EK is only a 15 mm miniature. But it has the known Imperial qualitity for such a size in my opinion. I believe that it was made 1870-1900.
Some other photos:Comment
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