Imp Medal Bar Question

[münster]

Hi Guys

Iam pretty novice to Imperial but for some reason a lot is coming into me from private buys.

This is probably a dumb question to the pros here but I got this bar today and the EK2 is last in order, is this possible? In TR the EK must always be 1st in order.

Its from private and the woman had it forever and there are no signs of it being monkeyed about.

Cheers and Thanks
Dion

[Don D.]

Dio, it is a fracken spange. Let me know what you want for it.

[münster]

Lemme go through what I got today Don, The Frau and Demon Child are over and I have to cook for them. Now for the question Don, Whats a Fracken Spange?? Why were they allowed to put the EK last?

[Don D.]

the ek is in first place. this bar is for wear on civilian dress.

[Brian R]

Nice frack bar. The Saxon medals should be (easily) switched.

[münster]

thanks bri,,they are on the wrong mounts?

[Gary B]

Dear Dion,

A frack mount is a reverse order mount with the highest award to the viewer's right. When worn on a civilian suit it is worn in a slanted style on the coat's left lapel with the highest award (right most) at the top, lowest at the bottom. If you go to page 418 on Angolia's FF &F vol 1 you can see one.

Gary B

[CRBeery]

If the first medal is a FA in silver and not a long service, this bar is not a frack and is the correct order for Saxony. The ribbons lead me to believe this also. Remember, they reserved the right to mount thier medals first during WW1. Bavaria is the same. The two medals simply need switched.

Dion, this is a nice NCO bar and I too would be interested in buying it.

Thanks,
CRBeery

[münster]

The first medal reads in German "True Service by The Flag" and has FAR on the obverse and IX on the reverse. Frack, Thanks, I like learning new things and the complexity of Imperial Medals, much more interesting then Ost Medailles I have to admit. It really is strange and almost irritating for me to look at it and see the EK2 last, it really makes me batty for some reason.

[VtwinVince]

Correct, not a Frackspange, but rather a correct wartime Saxon precedence. However, the General Honor Cross should be replaced by either a silver or bronze Friedrich August Medal.

[Don D.]

If the first medal is a saxon LS medal than it must be a frackspange. The LS would not come before an FA medal.

[regular122]

Agree with Don on the order. While the Saxons certainly could mount their bravery awards before the EK, the long service would be out of place. The first bar below is the same medal as shown in number 1 with the green ribbon but this bar was in the post 1934 order by regulation. The second bar shows the Saxon medals placed first on a standard bar. Given this arrangement with the EK last, I, too think it would have to be a Frack. Steve

[landsknechte]

This is definitely a frackspange, dating from sometime between WWI and the institution of the Hindenburg Cross in 1934. During WWI, it was the norm for Saxons and Bavarians to mount their decorations ahead of similarly ranked Prussian decorations. From their point of view, they both had kings as did Prussia, and were thus on equal standing. However if this were a wartime non-Frack bar, the Friedrich August Medal should come first, then the Iron Cross, then the long service medal. I don't know when the Prussia-first rule came into place, but I presume for this it must have been sometime prior to 1934.

[CRBeery]

The odd thing here is the ribbon reveal. The highest medal/order on a medal bar typically has full ribbon reveal with the rest around 3/4 to 1/2. Look at the Saxon posted on the bottom of the picture from Steve. This bar is correctly mounted FAM/FAM/EK2. The FAM ribbon is fully shown and this is a very typical mount for Saxony. This is not a frack bar. Now back to the bar from Dion, the ribbons are mounted in the same standard fashion.

A photo of the back may end this as the pin is also reversed on a frack bar. For now I still vote regular bar with a substitute ribbon or a bar that the vet changed after he was awarded a LS. Most of my Saxon bars do not has a LS.

[landsknechte]

IMHO, an atypically constructed bar makes more sense than one that has everything in completely the wrong order. A long service medal in front of two bravery decorations seems highly unlikely.

A photo of the reverse of the bar might explain a lot.