Tank badge - Opinion's ....

[Robin Lumsden]

Similar back, Ferg.................but different pin.

I think there were a lot more makers of these things (all the way between 1921 and 1945) than collectors generally believe.

[Brian S]

Similar back, Ferg.................but different pin.

I think there were a lot more makers of these things (all the way between 1921 and 1945) than collectors generally believe.

Why would there be?

[Robin Lumsden]

Why would there be?

Hello Brian.

I don't see why not.

Many different makers produced other ex-Imperial/Weimar badges in a variety of qualities throughout the 1920s and early 1930s.

While the Tank Badge has a certain 'mystique' to modern collectors, it was just 'one of many other badges' to them at the time.

Imperial and Weimar medals and awards were being 'unofficially' made (and sold) to the nth degree before the Nazis came to power.

That's why Hitler put a stop to it soon afterwards with his tighter regulation of the whole medal making business.

[jaba-the-hunt]

Hello Brian.

I don't see why not.

Many different makers produced other ex-Imperial/Weimar badges in a variety of qualities throughout the 1920s and early 1930s.

While the Tank Badge has a certain 'mystique' to modern collectors, it was just 'one of many other badges' to them at the time.

Imperial and Weimar medals and awards were being 'unofficially' made (and sold) to the nth degree before the Nazis came to power.

That's why Hitler put a stop to it soon afterwards with his tighter regulation of the whole medal making business.

I don't know much about this bagde but with less than 100 awards i can't belive that there are so many variations.
I can make some exemples on the Erinnerungsabzeichen für Heeres und Marineluftschiffer because this badges where made in the same period and also private purchase.
I know less than 5 original variations of Heeresluftschiffer badges that are 100% made in the period. And this badges are 4 or 5 time more awarded that the tank badge. I'm sure that there are more variations but not many more.

And when i count the variations of the tank badge wich where sold as "original" on several auctions or dealer or posted here there are more than 10.
Regards Alex

[Don D.]

The "100" awards is suspect at best. You only have to do the math on the number of guys serving in tanks on the German side to see that. http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...ght=A7V&page=2

[jaba-the-hunt]

Hi Don,

i told that i'm not an expert of this badges and i only want to make some similarities to the Luftschoffer badges.

How many badges you thing where awarded?

I thougt that there were only a few of Kampfwagen Abteilungen (about 5) and maybe not all obtained the conditions for awarding.

How ever i don't think that there so many different productions.
I don't see one Luftschiffer badge sold in the last 3-4 years but more than 5 tank badges.

Regards Alex

[Don D.]

Approx 700 men served in tanks for the German army. 5 A7V detachtments and 5-6 detachtments in captured british tanks. Even if only 1/3 had 3 attacks or more then that gives us 233 men elegible for the badge. factor in wounded men who were also eleigble regardless of number of assualts. The point is that the number 100 is just too convienent and round. It is a good number for an initial order though. You have to wonder why an order was placed in the first place though. This badge was not awarded but those elegible had to apply for it and pay for it out of pocket. So why would a german officer put in an order for 100 badges? I can only see that if he was planning on presenting them to tankers still on active duty.

[jaba-the-hunt]

The tank badge was awarded like the Erinnerungabzeichen for Luftschiffer too. But the guys got only a document but not the badge.
There are a lot of awards that never been awarded more than 200 times and it was also founded. Look at the Erinnerungabzeichen for navy pilots and abserver, Ehrenpreis and the Ehrenbecher für Angriffe aus der Luft (with only 9 known awards also founded at the same time like the tank badge).

The Erinnerungabzeichen for Luftschiffer and the Ehrenbecher für Angriffe aus der Luft where founden because the disbandment of Luftschiffertruppe, to honnor this guys. I think the tank badge was also founded for honnor this couple of guys.
Regards Alex

[Don D.]

Correct but again, they had to buy them out of pocket. Being on the not winning side of the war probably did not lend itsself to guys going out and buying badges. I think these became more popular after the Polish Campaign where the Panzertruppe showed its stuff.

On another note, period photos of patriotic displays in store front windows will usually show this badge too. Not all that were made went to recipiants.

[Don D.]

This one is mint/unworn. It is made of nickle steel and was probably made in 1940 as a display piece. The hinge/pin/catch is the same as the one found on the Juncker NS PAB.

[Don D.]

reverse.

[Don D.]

For another comparision, how many makers were there for the Legion Condor Tank Badge? 500 issued all on one day yet I believe there have been 4-5 makers identified, only one of which made the issue pieces.

[Ferg 1]

I saw a photo once of a town hall in Germany in the 20's/30's and it had a display board on the wall showing a selection of WW1 badges ,pilot badges ,tank badge ,airship badge etc.. I was told ,and I have no reason to doubt it that these were in most German town halls in this period to honour the WW1 veterans. So given that ,there must have been quite a few display pieces produced. Anyone else heard of this ? Ferg1.

[jaba-the-hunt]

For another comparision, how many makers were there for the Legion Condor Tank Badge? 500 issued all on one day yet I believe there have been 4-5 makers identified, only one of which made the issue pieces.

4-5 makers of the tank badge is OK but i saw about 10 different variation. And saw about 5 variation of the Luftschiffer badge and this were more than 400x awarded.

Regards Alex

[Don D.]

Each maker of the LCTB had his own variation. Now, the KWA was made for a period of 20+ years at a time when the large house jewelers produced thier own dies in house to fill orders. Standardization of war badges was a thing of the future. During the 20-30s regulating things was very loose. One look at some of the Weimar Era medal bars will tell you this.

How many Grand Crosses to the 1939 Iron Cross series were made? Only one was awarded so I guess only 2-3 were made? Except you see them in patriotic displays too. Look at RKs. They were only issued for 6/12 years. Look at how many makers there were and the number of variations. Look at all the unissued ones around today.

Bottomline is that the 100 number is just too convienent to be believable.