Imperial German Ordnance and Battlefield Debris, Part 1

[JensF.]

Hi folks,

Rick L. told me that this is something for the Imperial Forum and not for Firearms. I'll start my Imperial Ordnance and Battlefield Debris thread now. For the modem users I'll split it in some parts because of the pictures.

These items are without any explosives (only the cartridges). No metal detector or something like that was used and no digging was made. No dead comrades, german or french, were "plundered" like some other sick "collectors" do on some battlefields. Some items are found and some are bought! These are items you can find on the ground nearly everwere on the battlefields of Verdun and always remember that there is blood on every relic! Every item is a piece of history, a part of a unbelieveable battle in which anything human died.
Nobody thought even in his wildest dreams what could happen after the 38 cm train-mounted navy cannon "Long Max" fired the first shot at 8:12 am on february 21, 1916 from the woods of Avocourt at the Citadelle de Verdun. These items are the witnesses of the inhumanity of two "civilized" nations.

I'll begin with some small and common relics.

[JensF.]

These are parts of copper grenade leading bands in different sizes. Some grenades (shells) had two or three of these bands. Below them are two buttons, a french one and a german one which are maybe from a tent liner or something like that. If someone can provide any informations about these buttons, please let me know. The german button has got three holes. I've never seen buttons with three; only with two or four!

[JensF.]

These are the remains of a german ammo pouch. Nearly nothing is left of the leather. The german 8 mm x 57 IS cartridges had a steel-plated lead bullet. The cartridges are still attached to their loading clips:

[JensF.]

Two caps for the fuse of the legendarey Stiehlhandgranate, model 1916. The earlier models had the cord fixed to the wooden stick with some paper. During the attack on february 21 1916 they got a lot of problems with these grenades. The rain made the paper weak and the cords were lost. Many soldiers died by their own grenades, still hanging on their belt! The cord here is a replacement but the little porcelain weight is original.

[JensF.]

Some french 8 mm Lebel and german 8 mm x 57 IS cartridges. Here you cann see them in the condition before and after cleaning. The french bullets were made of massive copper or bronze! To the right you can see some 12 mm shrapnell bullets, made from lead or steel. Between 200 and 400 of these were inside a shrapnell-shell. The (time-)fuses for these shells and its function will follow.

[JensF.]

Last one of this part are the remains of two french Lebel bayonets. The older 18?? type with scabbard and the scabbard for the later model:

[JensF.]

This might be of interest for our ammo-collectors:

The cleaned german cartridge is marked on the bottom:

12 o'clock position: 14
3 o'clock: S
6 o'clock: DM
9 o'clock: 10

So it was manufactured in October 1914 by the Deutsche Munitionsfabriken, Karlsruhe and it has got the S-bullet (Spitzgeschoß).


The french one was made in February 1915 an got the markings "BS" which should be the maker.


Another german one got the markings "P" for Polte, Magdeburg and the marking "S67". Spitzgeschoß and the cartridge was made from an alloy consisting of 67 % copper and 33 % zink.

[jeeeensy]

Hi,, I thought I would ad a few bits for the Imperial Thread to.
This is the Kugalkopft Grenade ( counterpart to the Poppenberg Grenade).

[jeeeensy]

Imperial

And here's the Poppenberg...
These did not remain in use for to long as Poppengerg roughly translated
means, handle with care ,, so i'm told anyway.

[GWA]

Wonderful stuff and information. Thank you.