2 secondelieutenants Müller

[David Müldner]

Dear All,

I am looking for more details on Secondelieutenant Hermann Müller, Adjudant of the 97 Infanterie-Regiment and his brother Wilhelm Müller, Secondelieutenant in the brandenburgisches 3. Jägerbataillon. I do not know when they were born, but there father was born in 1824. Therefore I take it that the brothers were not active during WWI, but rather might have seen action in 1870/71. I would like to know if they were awarded any award, saw action in the Franco-prussian war for sure and their NCO career.

Lots of questions, and I dont know wehther the resources of this era are sufficient, but I would appreciate any details on them both.

Thanks

David M.

[McCulloh]

Hermann is listed as Adj. in the 1886 Rangelist but I see no trace of his brother in 1886. In 1892 Hermann was PremierLt. of the 7th company and his brother is still missing. Neither is listed in the 1905 Ranklist.
Glenn has a lot of the old Stammlisten and if he might be able to help you more.

[David Müldner]

Hi McCulloh!!

First of all, thanks for the quick response! second I have 3 questions: would any awards be listed at Hermanns entries? Second: I am not quite sure about the exact formation of Infanterie-Regiments of the time, but I assume they were devided in somewhat like 4 Bataillons which had each 3 companies? So the 7th company should be in the 3rd Bataillon of the Regiment? Would his 1892 entry also give the date of his PLt promotion?

On the data on his brother, I forgot to mention that besides mentioning him as a SLt in JB 3, he was also (or later/earlier) a Forstreferendar.I dont know if or what this could say about him not showing up....but that's all the data I have on him

Thanks again, to all

David

[McCulloh]

Nope- no decorations listed in my rankbooks.
Also, the senioity dates didn't start being printed until a little later (@ 1900) so I am stymied, otherwise I'd be able to cross reference him (there are a lot of Mullers) with some certainty. Nope-no date of promotion listed.
As I recall,infantry regiments were composed of three battalions (with some exceptions) made up of 4 companies each. Each battalion had 570 men-going to @1000 upon mobilization.
I would assume that Company #7 was the 2nd battalion, but can't say for certain.

[David Müldner]

Yeah, I know the difficulty with Müller....its to bad so many details were only implemented in a later stage...thanks for checking though...maybe Glenn will be able to tell me some more from his Stammliste.....

[Andy Baus]

David,

After digging through a few Ranglisten, as well as other sources, I came up with the following information on Hermann, identified as an Adjutant in IR 97. Unfortunately, I have not come up with any Müller in Jäg. Batl. 3. There is a "von Müller" but I doubt he is the man you are seeking. It is quite possible he went into the reserves, but I have not paged through the Reserve Officer section of JB 3 to find that out. Anyway, here is what I found on Hermann: Incidentally, how do you know his first name?

Hermann Müller (??-30.10.14 killed in action)
Sep 14-30.10.14 Batl. Kom. in Res. Inf. R. 222<O</O
22.03.14-Sep 14 Kom. d. Landw. Bez. Friedberg
00.10.13-22.03.14 b. St. d. Inf. R. 159 (Mülheim a.d.R.)<O</O
1910-00.10.13 II./Inf. R. 70 (Saarbrücken)<O</O
27.01.07-1909 aggr. d. Inf. R. 142 (Mülhausen i.E.)<O</O
1905-27.01.07 Chef 12./Inf. R. 142 (Mülhausen i.E.)
01.04.97-1904 Chef 9./Inf. R. 136 (Dieuze)<O</O
27.01.95-01.04.97 Chef 14./Inf. R. 136 (Dieuze)<O</O
1893-27.01.95 in 12./Inf. R. 97 (Saarburg)<O</O
1891-1892 in 7./Inf. R. 97 (Saarburg)<O</O
1890 Adj. d. Inf. R. 97 (Saarburg)<O</O
1885-1889 Adj. F./Inf. R. 97 (Hanau/Saarburg)<O</O
1883-1884 in 3./Inf. R. 97 (Hanau)<O</O
<O</O

1914 awards: PRAO4 PDK<O</O
<O</O

Oberstlt. <?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" /><st1:date Month="4" Day="18" Year="2013">18-04-13</st1:date> G<O</O
Major <st1:date Month="1" Day="27" Year="2007">27-01-07</st1:date> G<O</O
Hptm. <st1:date Month="1" Day="27" Year="1995">27-01-95</st1:date> A5a
Oberlt. <st1:date Month="4" Day="17" Year="1990">17-04-90</st1:date><O</O
Leutn. <st1:date Month="12" Day="15" Year="1981">15-12-81</st1:date>
<st1:date Month="12" Day="15" Year="1981"></st1:date>
<st1:date Month="12" Day="15" Year="1981">Andy</st1:date>

[David Müldner]

Andy man, you rock!!!!!

How do I know his first name? Well nto put it simple,

the aunt of Carl II. M******252;ldner von M******252;lnheim, Hauptmann in the F******252;silier-Regimemt Graf Moltke(who was the father of the WWI Major and aide de camp to the crownprince Louis III), Maria Elise Carolina M******252;ldner von M******252;lnheim married the father of the M******252;llers, Johann Georg in his second marriage. And basically I am reseraching the MvM family


He is even in the DOA!!!!!!!!!!! (just looked him up in mmy library copy isnt this just sooooooexiting)

[David Müldner]

Regimental history

Although replying to myself, this is part of a new sub-subject

As I found on the internet, there should be a History on the Acts of RIR 222, by Max [von] Rotsmann

I wonder if there would be any kind of mentioning of the death of Oberstleutnant von Müller, or any other details on him for that matter, in this book....circumstances of the RIR by the end of october 1914 for example...would there be a chance of any one of the members of this forum who have access the book or even have it in their collection.

I would be very greatfull!!

David

[Daniel Murphy]

Reserve Regt. 222 was in the 95th Reserve Brigde of the 48th Reserve Division. The division was formed between August and October 1914 and were trained at the Oberhofen Lager. Concentrated near Metz in the middle of October, the division was transferred on the 25th to the area between Armentieres and La Bassee (Fromelles ). They stayed in this area until Nov 1, by which time Obstlt. von Muller had apparently been killed. He did not survive his first five days at the front, how sad.
Dan Murphy

[Glenn2438]

Hermann Müller

Here is Oberstleutnant z.D. Hermann Müller's death announcement published in the Allgemeiner Anzeiger zum Militär-Wochenblatt on the 14th of November 1914. The announcement was placed by the commander of Landwehrbezirk Friedberg, Major von Branconi, Müller's successor as Bezirkskommandeur Friedberg.

Regards
Glenn

[David Müldner]

That's great Glenn,

I am sure that wasnt easy to find

Thanks

DM