Identify this GeneralOberst Portrait - Austro Hungarian

[GdC26]

Looking at the pic again, I think you are right - the cypher seems to be set on a green background. So Luxembourg Oak crown Knight, not Russian St. Georg order.

[GaHistory]

Detailed Pics of the Medals - Thank you for Opinions

Looking at the pic again, I think you are right - the cypher seems to be set on a green background. So Luxembourg Oak crown Knight, not Russian St. Georg order.

Here are details - as good as I can get with phone and lighting in the room - glare on the oil/shellac surface is bad. According to the photos posted and from what I can see (and know know from your responses) - Luxembourg Oak crown Knight.

**So you think that would be a help in ID? - I would love to actually find out who he is but I know the chances may be slim. Thank you all for the help - very much appreciated!

[David Müldner]

Here are details - as good as I can get with phone and lighting in the room - glare on the oil/shellac surface is bad. According to the photos posted and from what I can see (and know know from your responses) - Luxembourg Oak crown Knight.

**So you think that would be a help in ID? - I would love to actually find out who he is but I know the chances may be slim. Thank you all for the help - very much appreciated!

Another possibly is to check the online militär schematismus for this combination.
They are on google books.

My guess would be a (staff)officer in the regiment whose proprietor was Willem 3.

[David Müldner]

Looking at the pic again, I think you are right - the cypher seems to be set on a green background. So Luxembourg Oak crown Knight, not Russian St. Georg order.

Great, I thought the ribbon has green stripes iso black. But I am no expert on t his

[David Müldner]

This would be my guess

He got his GHVP2bX 15.11.1849. First image from.the militärschematismus I mentioned. Second one Allgemeine Zeitung München 1852.

[GdC26]

I think you may be correct, the 1856 Hof und Staatshandbuch for Grossherzogtum Hessen has him down as retired k.k. Oberst and confirms him as a recient of the order of Philip the magnanimous (could not immediately find what grade).

https://opacplus.bsb-muenchen.de/Vta...e=de&c=default

and the Baden Stastshandbuch 1884 as recipiënt of the BZL 1. Klasse, also 1849 (das Revolutionsjahr).

I found a page that appears to reference a painting of him - I need to review that to confirm, and will post it here if relevant.

[David Müldner]

I think you may be correct, the 1856 Hof und Staatshandbuch for Grossherzogtum Hessen has him down as retired k.k. Oberst and confirms him as a recient of the order of Philip the magnanimous (could not immediately find what grade).

https://opacplus.bsb-muenchen.de/Vta...e=de&c=default

and the Baden Stastshandbuch 1884 as recipiënt of the BZL 1. Klasse, also 1849 (das Revolutionsjahr).

I found a page that appears to reference a painting of him - I need to review that to confirm, and will post it here if relevant.

I believe you will find the combination of his awards, especially with the OEK3 to be quite unique.
Please let us know about the painting of you find a reference. I would love to find an oberview of his career. Did you consider posting your question at the gmic forum?

[GdC26]

I believe you will find the combination of his awards, especially with the OEK3 to be quite unique.
Please let us know about the painting of you find a reference. I would love to find an oberview of his career. Did you consider posting your question at the gmic forum?

Thanks David. As said, the portrait is not mine. From what I saw, Ludwig Franul von Weissenthurm served in the corps of engineers (Geniekorps) under Erzherzog Johann (he apparently was attached to the Erzherzog's staff):

https://books.google.nl/books?id=Hix...urm%22&f=false

https://books.google.nl/books?id=kLQ...nthurm&f=false

This site:

https://archive.org/stream/katalogde...0unse_djvu.txt

has the full text of an exhibition catalogue of the "HISTORISCHEN PORTRÄTAUSSTELLUNG IM KÜNSTLERHAUSE (1680 — 1840)" held in Vienna in 1880. It lists a portrait of the colonel, but not the one shown here:

"Herr Oberst Franul von Weissenthurm
801. Männliches Porträt. II. Hälfte des 18. Jahr-
hunderts. Pastellgemälde auf Pergament.
Brustb. ? oval. h. 43.
Unbekannter Meister."


This site mentions a Ludig Franul von Weissenthurm and gives his year of death as 1894 - that may be the person depicted in the painting, but could also be one of his children: https://books.google.nl/books?id=uwe...franul&f=false

[David Müldner]

Yeah I saw his attachment to the engineers staff. Probably in 1848 and why he got his internationals only awards.
Should be an ancestor. The family, originating from Fiume in Istria was ennobled 19.11.1712. As the portrait says 18. Century, ot could very well be his grandfather.

For any genealogical sources on the family, you should check the aeiou website on austrian nobility. They might have made it to into the BTB.

[ErikMuller]

Looking at the pic again, I think you are right - the cypher seems to be set on a green background. So Luxembourg Oak crown Knight, not Russian St. Georg order.

Yes it is. He was made a Knight in the Order of the Oak Crown on 17.08.1846 (Ludwig Franul von Weissenthurn, captain of engineers in Austrian service)

[Elmar Lang]

Hello,

a highly interesting disussion indeed, leading to the identification of the portrayed gentleman.

I see a curious detail, now that I can use the computer: a "smart"phone, van be really "dumb", when it comes to study pictures.

I see that the collar appears as black, with the Golden, staff officer's braid, but the cuffs are dark red (velvet)? Collar and cuffs should be of the same colour…

I'd better return to my books on austrian uniforms...

[GaHistory]

Amazing work. I have been away from my phone and computer for a few days. To check back and find such details and information has really touched me and to say that I have immense appreciation and respect would be a complete understatement. What little investigation I had worked on was not producing much. This is like a History Hunters episode. This forum never ceases to amaze me.