Jingle Bells, Jingle Bells,

[Bone Collector]

Nice Picture.

The Schellenbaum as earlier noted in this thread, originated in the Turkish Ottomon Empire. Many of the schellenbaums originally used in the 18th and 19th Century in Europe were actually captured when the Ottomons were successfully pushed out of Eastern Europe. The two European countries that still continue to use them routinely, both in civilian and military bands, are Russia and Germany.

The way I understood it was that it was in fact a gift and not a theft. I have seen this shellenbaum (or Mohammed's banner in swedish) in parades so it's not just in Russia and Germany. It is also one of the royal guards most valued traditional item.

[Mike G.]

I don't think I said anything about the Schellenbaum in Sweden being stolen. In fact, I don't recall saying any Schellenbaums were stolen.
Nor did I say the Schellenbaum was "Only" used in Germany and Russia.

Since there seems to be confusion, for clarification:

I said the following:

a). Nice picture. (Said about the pic you posted of the example in Sweden).

b). The Schellenbaum originated in the Ottomon Empire.

c). The first examples used in Europe were captured from the Ottomons when they were expelled from Eastern Europe.

d). Schellenbaums are "Routinely" still used in Germany and Russia. By routinely, I mean anytime there is a parade, many of the bands in the parade (Civilian and Military) are still today, led by someone carrying a Schellenbaum.

[Bone Collector]

I don't think I said anything about the Schellenbaum in Sweden being stolen. In fact, I don't recall saying any Schellenbaums were stolen.
Nor did I say the Schellenbaum was "Only" used in Germany and Russia.

It's alright, we just have different definitions.
When it comes to military history, for me "captured" is just the same as stolen. Just a fancier word for aquireing an item of the enemy.
The use of schellenbaum in other countries exept Germany and Russia was just me reading to sloppy.


/Mikael