Dark collar police generals tunic

[Bone Collector]

This one got me thinking.
http://cgi.ebay.com/EAST-GERMAN-POLI...QQcmdZViewItem

It's a dark collar but it's not closed. I haven't (ever) seen a police dark collar tunic, maybe they actually looked like this. Or is it west german or something?

/Mikael

[David H]

Interesting tunic, I must admit I saw this one and if I wasn't in the process of buying alot of other items I would have been tempted to take a chance on it, although I would have liked to have handled it. I had a little chat to the seller about it and still couldn't make my mind up...
The police did use dark collar tunics in the late 50's/early 60's mostly closed at the neck and also open collar walking out jackets but these are very scarce... Unfortunately this is where the problems arise with the generals tunic,..it doesn't look that old. The buttons are one piece construction which are post 1960, the collar patches are post 1978 pattern, the boards are post 1966 pattern with pre 1968 stars.

It is obviously a good quality private tailored piece and generals did have a degree of latitude, but when was it made??? it could be very late....

Basically if I had it in my hands I would be able to tell straight off, but I can't.
Someone may have got a bargain or bought a donkey! but unless we get to see it in alot better detail it will be difficult to say 100%

[iannima]

I bow to Dave's superior knowledge, but it looks West German to me. Admittedly I am not an expert on police uniforms or West German items...

[David H]

Matteo never bow to anyones knowledge as we can all make mistakes!!!

I'm not convinved it is west German, at the moment, but it could be, I must say when I first saw it I had the same thought as you, only after speaking to the seller and asking a few questions did I begin to faulter, again I'd like to see it up close, as I'm basing some of my views on what Iwas told about the tunic. One thing not shown in the pictures is that it has lace holes for attaching the shoulder boards (very EG),

[Tribley]

I am pretty sure this is not a West German tunic, at least not BGS. My observations/comparisons:

-The color looks somewhat lighter to me.
-The lapels are designed differently.
-The pockets are not scalloped as much.
-There is too much space between the buttons.
-The stitching around the collar is too close to the edge, unless the piping is sewn over the collar.
-The cuffs look a little small.
-The lining is too light colored unless it is tailor made.
-There is no vertical fold in the center of the lining. Every West German tunic that I own -- BGS, Police, and Bundeswehr all have this center fold. This includes tailor made, private purchase, and issue tunics.

-Jordan

[Gordon Craig]

Gents,

I'm with Jordan. This is definitely not a West German tunic. I to saw it and passed. I didn't bother emailing Paul because he is rarely willing to spend any time or effort in discussing what he has for sale. His answer to me in the past has been that I should just buy it becasue I can always return it if I don't like it. Still, it would be nice to have handled it to be sure!

Cheers,

Gordon

[Gene T]

Is it me or do the sleeves look unusually short relative to the length of this tunic for something originating from the DDR? Even the long-skirted Bundeswehr tunics don't quite reach these decidedly relaxed proportions. This one isn't even long skirted, given the placement of the buttons. Perhaps the prescient general had had some baggy pants custom tailored as well to complete that long-torsoed short-legged look currently in vogue among teenage boys?

Of course, the tunic could simply have been made for someone with short arms, but that's just too obvious to merit any idle rumination . . .

[iannima]

that long-torsoed short-legged look currently in vogue among teenage boys?
.

Off Topic... I am glad I am not the only one to find distateful the currently fashionable breach of Greek canonical proportions...
Sorry for the intrusion.

[Stefas]

This seller "Last frontline" buys a lot GDR stuff on ebay.I saw his name often on different bids.
I geuss he knows what he sells.

[Mike G.]

Regarding the question about the apparent short sleeve length.

I've seen many Tunics (Mostly higher ranks or Band members) cut this way. They are cut for people with large girths at the waist and stomach (Beer bellys). When the Tunic is put on, it stretches and fills out at the stomach area, while simultaneously riding upward. The sleeves then become proportionate to the Tunic.

If you look at this Tunic closely, it is clear it is cut exactly in this fashion. Buttoned, there are a tremendous amount of rinkles at the waist area visible in it. I'm certain that the person for whom it was intended, filled it out - so once put on and in wear, they appeared normal next to the other more physically fit ("Lean, Mean, Fighting Machine" Combat Arms guys) Generals, when in their presence.

[Stefas]

Regarding the question about the apparent short sleeve length.

I've seen many Tunics (Mostly higher ranks or Band members) cut this way. They are cut for people with large girths at the waist and stomach (Beer bellys). When the Tunic is put on, it stretches and fills out at the stomach area, while simultaneously riding upward. The sleeves then become proportionate to the Tunic.

If you look at this Tunic closely, it is clear it is cut exactly in this fashion. Buttoned, there are a tremendous amount of rinkles at the waist area visible in it. I'm certain that the person for whom it was intended, filled it out - so once put on and in wear, they appeared normal next to the other more physically fit ("Lean, Mean, Fighting Machine" Combat Arms guys) Generals, when in their presence.

Yeah,youre right Micheal.When I look at " massgeschneiderte" General uniforms,I always first look at the size.These sizes are always a little different than the massproduktion sizes.Longer ore shorter sleeves,beer bellys etc.
Most off the fake ore after 1990 poductions got the massproduction cut.

[Gordon Craig]

Gents,

Here are some photos of the an early (50's/60's) BGS Presidents tunic for comparison with the dark collared East German Police tunic that started this thread. While there are similarities, when compared, the dark collared tunic sold by lastfrontline is definitely not West German.

Cheers,

Gordon

[Gordon Craig]

A close up of the dark coloured collar.

[Gordon Craig]

A close up of the cuff turn up.

[Ralph P]

Gordon - Very nice...not much more I can say...

Well maybe something...Are there any marking within the tunic?