Red Star & Red Banner Research, Abramov

[PaulR]

Here is another research grouping that has just arrived. Like the Red Banner Screwback, you might have seen this one on the other forums as well. If so, sorry to bore ya!

Here is the man,

[PaulR]

Again, with the help of a researcher friend.

Vasily Alekseevich Abramov, Engineer-Major, Senior Engineer-Inspector for armaments. Engineer aviation service of Long Distance Operating Aviation (the “A.D.D.”) Born 1909, Russian, CPSU since 1937. Served against the White Finns in 1940. In Patriotic War with the 98th D.B. Aviation Engineering since 22 June 1041, from September 1941 and in 4th Aviation Engineering D.D. from 24 March to 13 April 1942.
In Red Army since 1931. No previous decorations. No next of kin—current address on LDOA Staff for the time being in the city of Ishime at number 26 Sovietskaya.

Citation for Order of the Red Star:

“In the field with the army since 22.6.41, in the LDOA system since September 1941. As engineer for armaments in combat units has maintained 1,900 combat flights without breakdowns or faults in technical personnel.
Since April 1942 has worked as Engineer-Inspector for armaments in LDOA of N.A.S., attending with the leading engineer for Li-2 aircraft. In this period, demonstrated himself to be an efficient, initiative-ful, disciplined and decisive officer. Accepted assignments entrusted to him with pleasure, hammering out with great energy and efficiency, finishing and resolving {{{word not in dictionary}}} problems at the earliest possible date. Took field units in re-arming Li-2 aircraft: for large caliber machine guns, installing inside fuselages plate holders for bomb carriers, made new crew compartments—as a consequence of which the Li-2 aircraft became more valuable for night bombing.
Took part in the ranks of the commission for testing aircraft armaments and {{{word not in dictionary}}}, well organized this work, establishing comprehensive accounting. Inspecting units—personally examined 200 aircraft. Constantly stays with the units, controlling, instructing and creating lines of instructions—obtaining correct {{{word not in dictionary}}} armaments and {{{again word not in dictionary}}} in units of the LDOA. Constantly led and busied himself with the officer staff of the LDOA, heightening their knowledge of aviation armaments. Supports with fellow Party Bureau of the CPSU the Party organization in the LDOA of the Engineer Aviation Service; to the benefit of the political and business authority of the entire structure of the engineer-aviation service and combat service units of the LDOA.
Deserves to be awarded—the Order ‘of the Red Star.’

4 November 1943, Deputy Chief Engineer of the LDOA for armaments, Engineer-Colonel ‘Znamensky’ “<!--IBF.ATTACHMENT_100894-->

He appears to have done 2 years draftee duty wuth "the Organs," arriving for military service as an Okhrannik (Guard in some part of the "NKVD system"????) at age 22 from the Paramilitary-something-not-in-dictionary Okhrana Staff of Moscow Military District at something-not-placename RVK Tula Oblast on 14 November 1931.

14.11.31 Red Army Private, 3rd Independent Tank Regiment, Moscow Military District

23.7.32 Cadet at 5th Military School for WPRA Armamaments Technicians in Leningrad

From Januray 1935 to 17.12.37 Junior Technician for armaments in 13th Aviation squadron, 81st Light Attack Aviation Brigade, Kiev Military District

15.11.37 Commander of Armaments Service Squadron, 34th Aviation Squadron, 81st Light Bomber Brigade, Kiev Mil Dist

21.12.38 Student at improvement courses for air force armaments engineers 2nd Leningrad Air Tech School

1.8.39 CO of armaments service squadron 40th High Speed Bomber Air Rgt, Baltic Military District

25.4.40 Armaments Engineer 98th Long Range Bomber Aviation Rgt, 42nd Long Range Bomber Aviation Division

23.9.42 Engineer for Armaments 433rd Long Range Aviation Regiment, 3rd Long Range Aviation Division, service agian confirmed by unit involved, 8.3.42

24.3.42 Armaments Engineer 4th Aviation Regiment for LOng Range Operations, 3rd Aviation Division for Long Range Operations, attested by unit 13.4.42 and that is where tHIS page ends.

Continued on a second set of personnel cards (huff puff)

30.3.42 Inspector of Armaments for EXPLOITATION Unit at Command of Long Range Aviation.

(I am not sure what "exploitation" (the Russian word is "yekspluatatsiya") means, but it suggests MAYBE use of captured enemy material?????.....)

22.1.43 Engineer Inspector for Aviation Armaments in the exploitation and repair/maintenance service at Command of Long Range Aviation

(Maybe "exploitation" means cannibalizing damaged planes? In any case he was at the main command of this branch of aviation.)

30.4.43 Senior Engineer Inspector for armaments in the service unit for exploitation of armaments as Engineer for Aviation Service at Command of Long Range Aviation

29.2.44 Senior Engineer Inspector for armaments and Assistant Commander for the exploitation of armaments unit, Command of Long range Aviation

28.5.45 Assistant Senior Inspector of Division for armaments in the 2nd Guards Bomber Aviation Division, 70th Guards Bomber Aviation Corps, 2nd Air Army Long Range Aviation, 43rd Air Army Long Range Aviation, 18th Air Army

20.12.51 Senior Engineer Inspector for repair/maintenance armaments unit for combat repairs/maintenance as Engineer of Aviation Service for aviation armaments at 43rd Air Army Long Range Aviation.

The lines at the bottom quite oddly say

"Statement of service cards delivered on the basis of the certified Personnel File of Lieutenant Colonel of Technical Services Abramov Vasily Andreevich" and is signed off on 13 August 1957 by Commander of Cadres 43rd Air Army, Colonel Sabin. Most peculiarly, the personnel cards (the upside down/right side up mirrored half "cards" are NOT period originals added to by each unit, but all obviously copied out at this time. Which begs the question: where WERE his original personnel cards and... why did Said Personnel File NOT come out with the research? Could the "Lichnoe Delo" have been pulled? If so, why?....

The entry up the side to the left states that he was discharged to the reserve per Section 59 (whatever THAT meant) and APPEARS to say that he was NOT granted the right "to wear military forms of dress" in retirement-- which would be MOST unusual. Unless the "ne uchet" following does NOT mean "not allowed" but instead is ??? "without restriction" or something and I am misinterpreting it. (???)

There IS a date of release which I had missed before--

21 July 1958 is when he was discharged to Vinnitsa City Military Commissariat as where he would be living.

That SHOULD have meant he SHOULD have gotten an Order of Lenin for 25 years service in 1956, which may be on ANOTHER Awards Record Crad which you did not get-- yours is dated 31 October 1952. If not.....


?????



AND he was entitled to--though whether he got it before discharge or was processed one afterwards-- the 1958 Armed Forces Jubilee Medal, since he was on active duty in February 1958.

You need somebody who knows about the terminology of Soviet air force units and WHERE they were in the 1950s for more. Was his 1951-58 unit in Korea 1951-53? What was "exploitation?"

<!--IBF.ATTACHMENT_103537--><!-- THE POST -->

[PaulR]

Here is one of many documents that came back with the research.

A citation for a Red Star(not for long service)

[PaulR]

The Belgrade medal came with the grouping, yet is not documented. I will see what I can find out on his unit's positions during the war to try and determine if this medal is possible for this officer. I was told that the medal could have been added to "fluff" up the grouping for sale. I will wait for further investigation before removing it from the grouping.

[PaulR]

Expecting more information soon...

[Gerd Becker]

I am so bored

Just kidding, great group and also a very nice research. Unfortunatley i don´t have any sources about the Airforce

[Soviet]

Do you have a copy of the award card? Is it the same as in the Order book?

[Dood]

I wish to upset.
This complete set too not present. Present only the first record in the document. In an extract it is spoken only about a red star. All other awards from others the person of 100 % And a medal Belgrad is not pleasant. It is similar to a fake. It is necessary for a photo close

[PaulR]

I do have the awards card, as well as his complete service record. I can post it all, if you would like. The awards are all listed (Except Belgrade) on the award card. There are about 12 pages of archival documentation for this grouping. Unfortunately, I only have the citation for the one Red Star order.

The Belgrade medal is original. The question is if it is original to the group.

I have had this set since 1992. I can assure you that they are original pieces.

I will make a close up of the Belgrade medal. :-)

[Dood]

Belgrad it is badly visible. Can also present.
Awards all of 100 % original. But they not Аbramov. A red Star № 2720773 it 1947-48 rewarding. And an award of a red banner № 374263 rewarding 1955-1960 And at you in the document they are written to one time and one handwriting. That cannot be!!!! Also that they are bought in 1992 in it there is no difference. It is assured of the words on 100 %

[Dood]

Here a situation as at you. The seller all over again insisted on originality. And after my explanations, has recognized my correctness. http://forum-su.com/topic51654.html

[desantnik]

Dood, all these pieces can belong to the same man. Although you are correct booklets can be faked, it is not the case here. Yes, the first award was written in 1943, but the other awards (long service) were written in later, especially if this is verified by archive research.

[Dood]

Hi
You probably have not understood, that I have written. At me it is bad with English. That you speak 100 % it not the present that happens, but in this case.
1. Red Star (2720733) & Red Banner are written in the document to one time. And they are let out among themselves with a difference of years 15-20, and written to one time by one handwriting!!!
2. In archive have given out the document only on red stars(329224). About Red Star(2720733) & Red Bannerthere not words!!!!!

[Nack]

Dood appears to be saying that the long-service ORS and ORB were added to the book at the same time, despite having #s that corrospond to award dates nearly a decade apart.

If you look closely at the last 2 entries, however, you can see that the handwriting is in fact different (note the 3s). Besides all the indications of genuineness, I don't think that this level of faking sophistication, both w/r/t odm and books, existed in 1992.

[desantnik]

Now I understand.

It is also possible (even if both of the last two entries are done by the same hand as Dood alleges) that they were done simultaneously at the later entry date of the Red Banner.

The recipient may have received a separate book for the Red Star, and then upon the awarding of the Red Banner he decided to consolidate two new entries (the RS and the RB) into the one 1943 booklet to have one booklet and not THREE.

Good point Dood, but I wouldn't be overly concerned. Dood is correct to warn everyone to look for discrepancies like this that more often that not show up. Unscrupulous sellers do this to add singles to a set to make the set more attractive and sell the singles at a premium as part of a "documented set".