Polish/Soviet Ribbon bar identification

[Tribley]

I bought this ribbon bar from a Polish Anthropology Professor several years ago but have never been able to determine exactly what all of the ribbon bars are since they are a bit faded. I believe this is a Navy bar since it has a dark blue felt backing but I have no references for Polish militaria so I am not sure. The ribbon bar is sewn to an Army tunic for display purposes since I don't have a Navy one. Is there any way to identify the specific person who this bar might have belonged to? Would this have belonged to an officer and did he serve after the war?

Here is what I think the ribbons are:

-Virtuti Militari, Gold
-Cross of Valor
-Partisan Cross???
-Cross of Merit, Silver
-Medal for Merit on the Field of Glory, Bronze
-Oder, Neisse and Baltic Medal -- Is this a Navy ribbon???
-Victory and Freedom Medal

-Order of Lenin
-Order of the Patriotic War, 1st Class
-Medal of Bravery
-Medal of War Merit
-Defense of Moscow, green faded???
-Liberation of Prague
-Victory over Germany in the Great Patriotic War
-Medal for Heroic Work in the Great Patriotic War

[desantnik]

I agree with your assessment of Soviet items, but except for the Partisan Cross and Oder, Neisse, Baltic medals, I'm not up to speed on Polish stuff. I've seen the Oder, Neisse, Baltic medal awarded several times to Soviet ground forces officer so I don't believe this is specifically a Polish naval award. Morever, I know the Soviets had several Polish ground formations in the Soviet Army, but I've never heard of a "Polish Navy" stood up. Doesn't mean it didn't happen though.

[Okrach]

Hi Tribley,

Let me follow Your guess (From above):

POLISH
-Virtuti Militari, Gold - CORRECT
-Cross of Valor - CORRECT
-Partisan Cross - CORRECT
-Cross of Merit, Silver - CORRECT
-Medal for Merit on the Field of Glory, Bronze - CORRECT
-Oder, Neisse and Baltic Medal - CORRECT (no it is not a navy ribbon)
-Victory and Freedom Medal - CORRECT
SOVIET:
-Order of Lenin - CORRECT
-Order of the Patriotic War, 1st Class - CORRECT
-Medal of Bravery - CORRECT
-Medal of War Merit - CORRECT
-Defense of Moscow - CORRECT (I am wondering why the green has faded only on this bar
-Liberation of Prague - CORRECT
-Victory over Germany in the Great Patriotic War - CORRECT
-Medal for Heroic Work in the Great Patriotic War - CORRECT

At the end... 100% accuracy - Nothing to worry about

[desantnik]

There is nothing "wrong" or faded about the Moscow ribbon. I've seen this color scheme plenty

[Tribley]

Thanks for the help!

Is it possible to determine who this ribbon bar belonged to?

-Jordan

[Okrach]

Thanks for the help!

Is it possible to determine who this ribbon bar belonged to?

-Jordan

still want more heh?

OKAY, this is how I see it - it is a Polish-Soviet ribbon bar...and they were many awarded among the Polish Army (the Polish ribbons are above what indicates that the awards were presented to the Pole).

Theoretically there is a possibility to find the recipient but...it won't be easy

You wrote You got it from a privat hands - go and ask

[Tribley]

The previous owner had no idea who it belonged to.

But I have a contact of another professor here in Florida who may be able to help me! Only a few hundred Gold VM recipients to search through...

-Jordan

[NavyFCO]

Is it just me, or does the Soviet part of the ribbon group seem rather odd? I've owned several hundred groups (including ones to Polish officers serving with the Russians, and Russians serving with the Poles) and I've never had a group that had this combination of decorations, in addition to the Labor Victory, which is also very odd... I can't fully put my finger on why I think it's odd, but something just doesn't look right about it.

Or, maybe I've just grown too suspicious in my old age...

Dave

[Okrach]

Or, maybe I've just grown too suspicious in my old age...

Dave

So many fakes on the market did their job I think - we are getting crazy and see fakes everywhere I am affraid. FAKE-O-MANIA?

I can't see anything wrong with this bar....

[Tribley]

Dave,

I noticed, when looking up the Soviet Orders in a couple books I have, that the labor victory ribbon did not seem to fit with the others -- it sounded more like a civilian and party official award to me. I bought the ribbon bar four or five years ago and showed it to a Soviet collector who lives in my area recently and he thought the bar was good. The ribbon bar had been sewn to a uniform or something by a previous owner or the original owner. Overall, the ribbon bar feels good to me and is made well. Can anyone else comment on the combination of ribbons or the bar itself? I'd like to know that it is good before trying to research it.

I also found a color photo of the Moscow defense ribbon in one of my books, the colors are identical to the ribbon on this ribbon bar.

-Jordan

[NavyFCO]

Jordan-

First, there's nothing wrong with the color of the Moscow Defense ribbon. It's a little faded (not much) but otherwise it's just as it's supposed to be.

I just think that a Lenin-OGPW 1st-Valor-Merit combination is a bit unusual. Not impossible, mind you, but quite unusual. I've owned (and seen) a number of OGPW 2nd-Valor-Merit groups, but those medals tended to all be awarded for similar things. The OGPW 1st was a bit higher and unless the person recevied their Merit medal for 10 years long service, I can't say that I've ever seen a group with this combination of awards without other awards added in. Once again, I'm not saying it's impossible, just highly unusual.

Of course, part of the explaination could be that the OGPW1st was a 1985 jubilee OGPW for wounds, which would then make sense. I am assuming that his Order of Lenin was given to him post-war from the Soviets and wasn't a wartime "valor" award.

As far as the Labor Victory, that's also quite unusual, but I'm really not sure how they dolled those out - I've seen too many "career military" groups with that medal in it and too many labor groups with the military Victory Over Germany medal to have it make much sense!

I think the group is plausible.... though very unusual. Also, I'm surprised that he's not wearing any Soviet jubilee medals, as they were awarded to foreigners as well.

Odd....

Dave

[Gerd Becker]

Is it just me, or does the Soviet part of the ribbon group seem rather odd? I've owned several hundred groups (including ones to Polish officers serving with the Russians, and Russians serving with the Poles) and I've never had a group that had this combination of decorations, in addition to the Labor Victory, which is also very odd... I can't fully put my finger on why I think it's odd, but something just doesn't look right about it.

Or, maybe I've just grown too suspicious in my old age...

Dave

No, its not just you, Dave. I agree with your explanation further down this thread. If the Military Merit Medal is for Long Service, and the Lenin too, he should have the 15 year Order of theRed-Star and a 20 year Order of the Red-Banner too. Not to speak of the Victory Medals. The Lenin just don´t fit in my opinion, except he either was a very effective Political Officer or did an exceptional act of Bravery to earn this order. An OGPW 1st class isn´t unusual, i guess, but an Order of Lenin? For what?

Maybe someone is able to look up, which polish Units had been involved in these campaigns?

Gerd

[Gerd Becker]

... further down this thread...

i meant, just above my post

[desantnik]

I share Dave's suspicions after he pointed them out. What was as Pole doing fighting for Moscow, let alone earning (possible) long service awards? If the awards weren't long service, the Combat Service Medal and Lenin combination is troubling. Both awards are at either end of the spectrum. Also, the labor/military combinations don't go together very well. Very wierd.

[desantnik]

To add, what is the guy doing with a partisan cross and campaign awards like Moscow, Prague, and Polish Oder/Neisse campaign medals that were given usually to regular forces. If he was a partisan, he would have maybe had ONE campaign medal in his area of activity. Possible, though highly unlikely that he served as a partisan and then greeted liberating forces to go fighting on to Prague - if so, how was he at Moscow?