A Beautiful Cap! What Is It?

[Bill D.]

Sorry, guys, but my knowledge of BDR material is limited. Even so, I could not pass up this cap when I saw it. The quality and workmanship are superb.

So...
Can someone help me out with information on this cap?
Period of manufacture?
Rank?
Branch of the Army (I'm assuming the "Combat Arms" branch).
What uniform would this have been worn with? It's a beautiful dove gray gabardine wool, but was there a gray BDR uniform?

Thanks, fellows!

[Bill D.]

Wonderful "saddle" shape and amazing embroidery of the insignia.

[Bill D.]

Branch insignia and visor embroidery...

[Bill D.]

Anyone recognize the maker?

[Steve 5]

Bill, its a rather nice post 1970 Army Officers visor cap, with one row of oakleaf devices for the rank of Major to Colonel (Oberst), junior officers, Leutnant to Stabshauptmann would wear the same cap but with an ebriodered scallopped edge...........I believe visor caps are not seen much these days (mores the pity) as even Staff Officers prefer the beret ! Would be worn with service tunic, I show such a tunic here, albeit Hauptmann rank.
Prost ! Steve.

[RamJet]

Yes, very nice piece, but the cord is wrong. It should be a simple black plastic or leather band, not a cord like this one, which was used on WWII caps.

The Luftwaffe still makes more use of these caps, look here:

http://www.luftwaffe.de/portal/a/luf...k5joCAANkpuU!/

http://www.luftwaffe.de/portal/a/luf...WeT7_AFBeAFE!/

http://www.luftwaffe.de/portal/a/luf...zwzyOxx8Gwg1l/

[herkules]

Schirmuetze / visor hat

Hi Bill,

the shown type of 'Schirmmuetze' had been worn by all

'Army / Heer' officers through out the years 1960 - 70 - 80

In the early 90s the beret increasingly replaced the visor hat.

left : Leutnant to Hauptmann

right : Major to Oberst

The 'crossed swords' just indicate 'Army / Heer'

Besides the crossed swords already the colour of the visor hat

indicated the branch (Lw: grey-blue / Navy: dark blue)

The cord on the visor shown must be 'jeweller made' , it did not exist !

the white paper slip inside was used to write the wearer's / owner's name on)

Best regards

Wolf

[herkules]

Schirmmuetze

Hi Bill,

Hi collector friends,

may I ask if this particular visor hat (Bill) could

have been a prototype since all 'comparable/relevant '

visor hats (Wehrmacht/NVA) used the cord instead of 'cheap' plastic.

Inside / back of 'sweat band' it reads 18'' (18 inches) very unusual ...

Thanks

Wolf

[Gordon Craig]

Wolf,

The answer to your question is no. These visor caps existed since the beginning of the BW. The only difference was that they were of a darker colour material to start with and changed to this lighter grey colour for the time frame mentioned in this thread. Officers always wore the plain black chin strap as shown in Steve 5s post.
I've attached some pictures of earlier caps for your reference.

Regards,

Gordon

[Gordon Craig]

#2

[Proud Kraut]

Let me add two pics of a dark grey Staff Officer's piece from 1963.





@Bill: Just replace the silver cord with a black "Lackband" and you'll have a top Schirmmütze!

Lars

[Bill D.]

My thanks to all of you, gentlemen!!
I truly appreciate your help.

I'm assuming, though, that the black cap band was secured with black buttons, and not the silver pebbled buttons as on this cap?

[Gordon Craig]

Bill D.

Silver buttons are correct for this time frame. The very early visor caps had dark gold buttons. Sort of a cross between gold and bronze. See the picture below for the buttons on the cap pictures I posted in post #10. This was changed after a few years to "Alt Silber" and then another change to the brighter silver buttons on the cap you own. I don't have pictures handy to post of the other buttons.

Regards,

Gordon

[Gordon Craig]

Bill,

In your first post you asked about the uniform that your hat would be worn with and the pictures in posts Steve made illustrate this light grey uniform well. However, there are a considerable rank of greys worn since the BW was formed and I think that this hat would have been worn with a uniform made from the same cloth. The cap does not appear to have a makers logo on the sweat shield so I would guess that the officer ordered the cap and the uniform at the same time. I have seen pictures of senior officers where this is very apparent although I do not have one to show at the moment. Having gone through my photo archives I am shocked that what I am looking for is not there. The best I can do to illustrate the uniform this hat would have been worn with is to show you a picture of an airborne unit on parade in Vienna. The guys marching behind them in the darker grey uniforms are in the Austrian Bundesheer.

Regards,

Gordon

[Gordon Craig]

Bill,

One more photo to show you the possible range of tunic colours one can find in the BW. These are all NCOs but the senior guys are allowed to buy their own uniforms and the very light grey ones in wear are probably of private purchase officers quality material.
The medals are not usually worn in the BW as is indicated by the airborne unit on parade. They are worn during the award ceremony.

Regards,

Gordon