Another unknown BRD hat

[Gordon Craig]

Gentlemen,

The cap shown below is up on Manions Auction House as a TR era Forestry hat which it is not. It appears to be a very early BRD hat with TR Forestry insignia added. The TR insignia, on the front, looks good. I suspect that the oak leaves on the side are original to the cap. I have never seen a cap like this and would like your opinion on what you think it is. Or prehaps someone has seen one of these correctly badged which would be great!
The shape is unusula and the short visor reminds me of the early TR GJ caps. TR Forestry caps were piped dark green around the crown and not silver as this one is. My best guess would be some hunting or shooting organization. What do you think?

Regards,

Gordon

[Gordon Craig]

A close-up of the TR insignia and the oak leaves.

[Gordon Craig]

I had asked Manions to put up pictures of the interior of the cap showing where the pins on the insignia went through the lining and they posted them the next day. I thought that I saved them and was going to post them here but apparently I did not. When went back to Manion's site to get them the hat was gone! It was there earlier today. So no shots of the pins on the inside of the cap.
The shots of the interior of the cap showed a post war type label. Here is a picture of the label in this cap compared to an identical label from a post war Forestry tunic in my collection.

[Gordon Craig]

Now, the makers mark, for the same firm, on the sweat shield of a TR Forestry cap in my collection.

[Gordon Craig]

Gentlemen,

I should say that I regret saying the name of the Auction House where this had was listed. In no way did I mean to indicate that they were doing something unethical. They made a statement in their auction listing that they had reservations about this cap as to its being TR. The purpose of this thread is to try and identify the cap as to time period, who could have worn it etc.
It is not meant to reflect in anyway on the site that listed the cap.

Regards,

Gordon

[chiffonnier]

I come across those style of oakleaves a lot.
there are lots of different makers and they vary in detail and finish.
they are still in use today and worn on the collar as a set.
and always it's a schutzenverein tunic (sport shooting).
this oakleaf symbol has been around for hundreds of years so often hard to date.
also used by freikorps pre war I believe.
this is some additional info on the STYLE of the badge and no means an opinion on the oakleaf on the cap Gordon posted.
here is a fine detailed set removed from a fifties schutzen gilde tunic;
regards,
kees

[Gordon Craig]

kees,

Thanks for your comments. My schutzenverein tunic has a different style of oak leaves. Good to know that the set you displayed comes from one of these jackets. Helps me put this cap in a certain category.
The schutzenverein units I see in photographs usually have a wide brimmed hat pinned up on one side with a crossed rifles badge on it. Perhaps in the early days following WWII they used other styles for a while.

Regards,

Gordon

[chiffonnier]

Gordon;you probably have one of these oakleaves on yours,I'll post 2 tunics with different ones.
just to show how much variation there is.
I don't bother to bring these back anymore,I usually just rip of the badges if they are worth being ripped that is.
first an early one with brass green painted buttons.
note the crossed rifles also on the horn shoulder patch button.
no inner markings.
really much to explore on this subject.

[chiffonnier]

this one is from the eighties.
lot of bling from shooting contests.
and again different oak leaves.
the brimmed hat you described indeed has a badge with crossed rifles.
and there should be feathers attached to the badge as well.
all the best,
kees

[chiffonnier]

and some more collar schutzen verein oak leaves.
bottom left has some age evidence and looks a lot like the one on the cap.
looks that is.
I'm not saying anything about the one on the cap.
all the best,
kees

[Gordon Craig]

Kees,

Nice tunics. Especially the second one with the cuffband and awards. My tunic has oak leaves very similar to the one with the cuffband. Thanks for posting them.

Regards,

Gordon