Stock Number Reference

[SprogCollector]

Is there an online or printed reference to reference the stock codes used in Bundeswehr uniforms? I'm trying to determine if 4805-12-120-4129 is a Handelmarine or Bundesmarine clothing item. Item is circa 1959/1960

[Edelweisse]

Stock Number

The Stock Supply Class...1st four (4) digits would be "8405 or 8415" for clothing. I think you transposed the 1st two (2) digits. The "12" designates Germany...and this NSNs started using the country designator code "00" & "01" USA..."12" German starting 1974...

These at NATO NSNs...

[Asbjoern]

As far as I know there is no overall reference list, only a full list of all actual numbers. Maybe there is a hidden warehouse were all the outdated versions are stored but this is not accesible to averyone ...

On your special "problem" ... if the garment has an NSN it should be Bundesmarine ...

Regards,

Jens

[SprogCollector]

HI,
Thanks for your replies. The number I entered is correct -- 4805-12-120-4129. It's am alleged Bundesmarine cap, circa 1960.

I ask about the numbers due to my other Marine schirmmützen (1964 and 1968 dated) have slightly different numbers to this older cap but share very similar numbers to each other despite being 5 years apart in age.

Note on the unknown cap, the second set of numbers has US I 2 "G" while the known Bundesmarine caps are both US I 2 "D"

Unknown cap
4805-12-120-4129
US I 2g/01/04540/08/9

1968 BM junior officer visor
4805-12-127-6060
US I 2d/01/15635/0046/7

1964 BM senior officer visor
4805-12-127-6041
US I 2d/01/15490/008/3

The other reason I bring up the NSNs is due to this thread:
http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...d.php?t=475028
Post #8 illustrates that this particular feldmütze was actually not a BW item -- rather it was proven to be "The NSN 8405-12-165-5057 = MUETZE, DIENST-, ZI which to me means Civilian Service Hat. "

[Asbjoern]

The Zi (zivil) for civilian means that it is determined for use by "non soldier emploies" of the BW like civil guards, notz for people outside the BW (may be this is clear to all, but maybe not...)

If you have generally identical hats with different NSNs .... do they have a different size ? Then this is the cause for different NSN.

The little difference between the caps is caused by the fact that they are made by differnet contractors in differnet years . This is possible as the TL (technical specification) only determines the mayor apearance of an item but not all details ...

And the US/ ... number is a contract number, so the small digit may be a difference in the number for example for another lot of a bigger contract. The US stands for a special department of the german procurment agency, the Bundesamt für Wehrtechnik und Beschaffung (BWB) in Koblenz responsible for the procurment of all types of clothing ... therefore you`ll find US numbers in all kind of textile. Latest from the mid 70ies on the BWB was reorgenized, the depertmnet got another name, the systems in naming contracts was changed. Now all these numbers start with a Q/ ...

I hope that helps a little ...

Regards,

Jens

[SprogCollector]

HI Jens,
Thanks for your reply.

In researching NSNs, it appears that the Federal Stock Class (1st 4 digits) of 4805 is no longer used so I'm not able to determine what class this item is although I suspect it was likely textile related and likely moved in to the 8405 class, at some point. 8405 is Uniforms, Mens. 8410 is Uniforms, Women's.

I did look at some of my early Heer and Luftwaffe feldmützen. My LW cap is 4805-12-121-xxxx and is dated 1959.

My 1960 Heer feldmütze is 4805-12-120-xxxx so I am now reasonably content that the cap I am researching is very likely an early Bundesmarine visor cap.

[Gordon Craig]

Jens,

That is an excellent description of markings in BW and associated BW caps. We probably should have done something like this some time ago.

Steve,

I have never seen NATO stock numbers in Handels marine items and I would not expect to. They are strictly civilian items of clothing and therefore not subject to NATO stock numbers. I know that you can site NATO stock numbers in ZB items etc. and they are a ciivilian organization as well but still under government controlled where as the Handles marine is not.

Regards,

Gordon