Time to clean up my BGS Dienstanzug

[Collectinsteve]

Hi all,

I have accumulated a fair number of BGS service uniforms over the past few years since accidentally expanding my camouflage collecting into generalized BRD stuff. Unfortunately, most of them have one or more problems with their badging. Either the item came to me incorrect or I put the wrong badging on when I was still learning the details.

I am starting this thread so we can all learn something about correct badging for the many different types of uniforms out there. Also I hope some of my undated items can be identified so I can make better matching sets.

In order to maximize learning, I will not point out any problems I am already aware of. At least to start out with. Instead I am interested to see what unbiased observations can be made by you all!

Here I go, from most recent to oldest using the tag information I was able to read (? next to things I am unsure of):

BGS 1991


BUND 1979?


BUND 1978 #1


BUND 1978 #2


No Date #1


No Date #2


No Date #3


No Date #4


1974 #1


1974 #2 (lightweight)


1966


1961

[Collectinsteve]

As a follow up, here are various trousers in my collection. Most are, unfortunately, not dated. If anybody can confirm dates (even if general range) that would be great.

Undated "Bluegreen" type


Lightweight "Green" type


Heavyweight "Green" type


1976


1974 (lightweight)


1966

[TCW 60]

The three trousers in dark green (the tree from the bottom upwards) were called Keilhosen.

[Klaus1989]

Hello Steve,
sorry I have been absent long time. Much to do! Anyway, "no date #3" has enlisted style patches for Oberstleutnant, which is not right. Should have officer bullion. I am still not sure, which type patches Meister ranks use - officer or enlisted. Have never owned Meister rank and from photos not sure. Your plain 1974 #1 is enlisted Dienstrock.

First trousers appear to be officer trousers (if gaberdine?). The other two are post 1976 green uniform trousers. Heavyweight are probably enlisted and lightweight officer? Enlisted are heavier furry wool. TCW60 is right, lower three trousers are Keilhosen. They are ski trousers for winter. The early Keilhose were standard uniform trousers (before 1953), but are very different.

regards
Klaus

[Collectinsteve]

Hi Klaus!

I was wondering where you were, seeing as this is (mostly) up your alley Not surprisingly, your comments are quite helpful.

I will be too busy to respond for the next few days, but here are some thoughts to your thoughts:

The 2nd and 3rd (green) trousers do not appear to be post 1976 in terms of the cloth or design. When exactly did the BGS cease using green trousers in favor of beige? 1978? The 1976 dated Keilhose picture below, on the other hand, are of the same cloth.

The 1966 Keilhose are not for use with the service uniform? Bummer I thought for sure it was for use with the standard Dienstjacke.

I am also sure that the arm badges for the Obsertleutnant are incorrect. The good news for me is that the eagle badge on it is in excellent condition and very hard to find! I already have something that needs one.

The arm badges for the "No Date #2" are likely wrong. They are at least not original as the stitching color is not correct. I also suspect that Meister ranks used a woven badge, not a Handgesticht type. I will probably move them to the Oberstleutnant uniform where I know they will be correct. Plus, even if they are correct for Meister ranks I would remove them and restitch them with the proper thread color anyway.

What I'm really curious about is if the last three uniforms' collar tabs are correct. I suspect they are not. Can you post a close up picture of 1950s and early 1960s tabs?

Thanks!!

Steve

[Klaus1989]

Steve,
it would help to see your "green" trousers compared with both pre and after 1976 Dienströcke. I think it could be colour variation rather than post 1976? The beige trousers were by most of BGS adopted 2001 (only GSE adopted beige trousers 1976). It was part of uniform changes to look more like Landespolizei (including shoulderboard style).

Keilhosen were worn with Dienstrock, but only for winter ski patrol. Not normal part of Dienstanzug. Only 1951-53 with Rundbundbluse were they normal part of it and 1st Model is different from yours.

I know little about Kragenspiegel. Second from bottom were definite added later (threads are easy to see). My late 1950s Dienstrock (1st Model, yours are all 2nd Model) has ones that are grey/green colour. I have no better photo now. Your 1961 Dienstrock is earliest 2nd Model I have seen. The pocket loop is for Sportabzeichen, if you want to complete it.



regards
Klaus