unusual WW1 British Dog Tags?

[sismithin]

I've had these for a very long time, I believe they are WW1 era British leather dog tags?
I've tried to research this type however haven't found anything identical, usually the two discs are of different shape and colour.
Can anyone shed any light?

They read as follows:
RUDGE. L.
C/E (Church of Dngland)
145(0 or 9)5657

Many Thanks
Simon

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[peter monahan]

The official ID tags are, as you say, in two colours and shapes. There is/was a legend that one colour was 'fireproof' and one rot proof, but that is untrue. As every battalion would have had a set of number and letter stamps, my guess is that these were produced locally by the wearer or one of his mates, rather than being offcially issued, but that's just a guess. The string is not the type usually used for offical tags either, a white cord. This looks like parcel twine.

[ROBB]

Perhaps they are toe tags ! Rob

[Jean-Loup]

Whoever made these, it was a good idea, as leather resists better to burial that the cardboard or whatever the reguar UK ID disks were made of.

[uscob]

My fist guess was an Emergency Issue, mabe made in a POW Camp as a replacement for the lost original ones.

[peter monahan]

That might make sense, Nico, though I'm not sure why POWs would be any more likely to lose theri tags than regular Tommies.

Jean, do you have evidence for your suggestion that the leather would survive better than the fibre issue tags? Perhaps from digs over there?

[uscob]

Whoever made these, it was a good idea, as leather resists better to burial that the cardboard or whatever the reguar UK ID disks were made of.

Makes sense to me too.
Especially around Berlin, they often find Leather Belts in a quite good, or better condition than even Metal items from the Battle of Berlin.

[Jean-Loup]

"Jean, do you have evidence for your suggestion that the leather would survive better than the fibre issue tags? Perhaps from digs over there?"

Leather usualy hardens in the ground, but remains remarkably intact, with markings still visible.
I dont have any experience finding fibre tags, and neither apparently does anybody else, for the very reason that they do not survive burial except in exceptional circumstances.

JL

[peter monahan]

Fair enough! I agree that leather is incredibly durable - I've seen Napoleonic boot fragments, for example, but couldn't think of any evidence/accounts of the fibre tags or similar as to whether or not they are found or not. Interesting.

[sismithin]

Hi All, wow sorry I didn't see these replies, I thought I selected for notifications. Never mind.
Really great info thanks guys. So I guess I'm non the wiser reall?. I do like the suggestions though.
Are they likely to be more WW2 than WW1 then in this case?

[Jean-Loup]

"Fair enough! I agree that leather is incredibly durable - I've seen Napoleonic boot fragments, for example, but couldn't think of any evidence/accounts of the fibre tags or similar as to whether or not they are found or not. Interesting. "

The fibre tags are defenetely not found, except when one is buried with a copper item, or similar exceptions.
Below, two example of dug up German helmet leather, one complete with initials.

[A H]

Not British Army ww1, nor Australian ww1 or WW2. Also not Canadian ww1 or ww2. Not got my files or books with me. Number block?......... South African?

[peter monahan]

Good to know, Jean-Loup. I wonder why copper makes the difference.

[Jean-Loup]

Copper is a natural bactericidal. That is why it is also sometimes used as a intrauterin spermecidal ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intrauterine_device ) and that is why fragments of preserved uniform are often preserved around buttons, badges and cartridges.

JL

[peter monahan]

Yes, I think I learned that in Grade 11 Chemsitry class. Then promptly forgot it! I have enough trouble remembering the "important stuff" such as which units wore back badges and Waffenfarbe colours, never mind all thsi scientific nonsense! Must be an important factor though, when it comes to digging relics. Thansk for the info., Jean-Loup.