Agent 0011-was there ever 00 Agents-James Bond types?

[seebee1]

Last week I visited the outstanding Canadian War Museum in Ottawa and one of the exhibits that caught my eye and gave pause for thought was this one. A small display case that contains an Automatic Pistol with the provenance of having belonged to a Michael Gregovitch, a Yugoslavian Agent who defected and worked for British Intelligence MI 5. The Pistol is shown with its 1955 dated presentation box, "To 0 0 11 from M I 5". My own view is that this is fictional and fabricated, surely 007 and other 00's were only in the mind of Ian Fleming? Also I thought that 00's worked for MI 6 and not MI 5? Thoughts and comments welcome, is there any truth in this? Regards, Clive.

[seebee1]

Images 3 & 4

[seebee1]

Image 5-Final. Picture of Pen Gun in the same display case, not associated though with 0011.

[Bond]

I could tell you, but then I would have to kill you.

[seebee1]

Best then that you keep it to yourself Mr Bond, is that James or Brooke?

I could tell you, but then I would have to kill you.

[Gary Wood]

I think you are probably right The pistol is a commercial .22 target pistol, the box again standard for that pistol.

[Bond]

Best then that you keep it to yourself Mr Bond, is that James or Brooke?

The name is bond, Jerry Bond. It don't quite have that ring to it.

When my daughter was to be born, I suggested to my now ex that we could call her Brooke if it was a girl and Basil Don if it was a boy, neither was used in the end.

Jerry

[seebee1]

Agree this is a .22 Caliber Target Pistol, just wonder when the Muzzle Brake-Compensator appeared on the MTS-1, pre or post 1955? The Pistol, Case and the attached plate make me wonder if this originated from Canadian Peter Mason? It is very unusual for the name and nationality of an MI-5 or MI-6 Agent to appear anywhere, let alone a public display Museum exhibit.

Basil Don would have been brilliant Gary, but as no one writes letters anymore, would be lost to history

I think you are probably right The pistol is a commercial .22 target pistol, the box again standard for that pistol.

[Bond]

Basil Don would have been brilliant Jerry, but as no one writes letters anymore, would be lost to history

You have to be the right sort of age to understand it I think and as you mention, a soon to be lost art and a reference that in the future will pass unnoticed.

JERRY

[SiPo]

When my daughter was to be born, I suggested to my now ex that we could call her Brooke if it was a girl and Basil Don if it was a boy, neither was used in the end.

Jerry

Brilliant.

Clive, with regards to the story...bollox me thinks!!

[Totenhead]

The name is bond, Jerry Bond. It don't quite have that ring to it.

When my daughter was to be born, I suggested to my now ex that we could call her Brooke if it was a girl and Basil Don if it was a boy, neither was used in the end.

Jerry

I like it !

[force136]

Ah the Canadian Bore Musuem

Hi Clive

There is a lot at this museum that is not correct. They have no interest in correcting their errors either. Nor do they want to do the research to back up their make belief stories. I also believe they have a display on Roger Caza of SOE who trained at STS 103 ( Camp X ). This is what their caption says. Caza was nowhere near STS 103. He was recruited in the UK and stayed there until they were transferred to the Far East.

I have records of several MI5 and MI6 Canadians of the WW 2 period and they simply refer to them by name (with alias if required). The 00 designation was an invention of Fleming.

In fact all that shoot em up spy nonsense is also the imagination of Fleming. We all know this rarely if ever happened. It was the purpose of SIS personnel NOT to make noise and be belligerent. The less attention they created the better. The carrying of weapons was simply for defence and to escape capture. For the most part they were to gather intel - that's it.

So there was no need to be licenced for something that was not actually part of your job description in the first place. However all soldiers have, by their profession, the right to kill if required.

Ken

Brilliant.

Clive, with regards to the story...bollox me thinks!!

[seebee1]

That really confirms it Ken. By the way, was there a Canadian Agent named Michael Gregovitch, or was this a fabrication as well? Just wonder where the item and story originated from, any ideas? I believe I did see the Roger Caza, Camp X, display, but would not have questioned it as I had no intention of looking into this further. Such a shame though that the Museum got this, and other things as well, wrong. Even worse if they will not correct errors pointed out to them. Regards, Clive.

PS: The Museum's canteen I thought was very good, had a couple of excellent Hot-Dogs with all the trimmings!

[force136]

Gregovitch

Hi Clive

I will keep an eye out for that name. So far I have only delved into the wartime members of SOE and SIS.

I need to clarify my earlier statement. Roger Caza was recruited in the UK and then operated in France. He was asked if he wanted to go to the far east and did. The Caza uniform in the display is impressive and actually has a Malayan made patch for the Malayan Peoples Anti Japanese Army ( Red patch with yellow stars ).

This is part evidence as to the actual origin of the brass Malayan Tiger cap badge mistakenly referred to as MPAJA. As you know Clive that badge is a Force 136 Malaya cap badge NOT an MPAJA badge.

Ken

That really confirms it Ken. By the way, was there a Canadian Agent named Michael Gregovitch, or was this a fabrication as well? Just wonder where the item and story originated from, any ideas? I believe I did see the Roger Caza, Camp X, display, but would not have questioned it as I had no intention of looking into this further. Such a shame though that the Museum got this, and other things as well, wrong. Even worse if they will not correct errors pointed out to them. Regards, Clive.

PS: The Museum's canteen I thought was very good, had a couple of excellent Hot-Dogs with all the trimmings!

[yellow]

Is there anything to Admiralty Intelligence in the museum?

When I think of Bond and Ian Flemming I think of the Royal Navy, rather than the M organisations emphasised in the later books/films. Plainclothes officers on-board Royal navy vessels, their true identities only known by the captain of the vessel. This is WW2 fact, not post war fiction.

So far we haven't mentioned these men on the forums excluding 30 Commando.

Interestingly enough the Royal Navy didn't attempt to hide their true names which I find amazing....including Ian Flemming, although the operative I knew of used an alias for his forenames yet retained his surname? The Alias stuck and he was hence forth referred to by his alias even in the London Navy Club.

What made me laugh was that in the Olympic Games opening ceremony. we see a scene where Bond goes to meet up with the HRH. The chap I knew of who served as Admiralty Intelligence, later became an aid to King George VI! Flemming was writing about real plans he formulated during the war years and applying them to a fictional background story. Like all good authors he was writing from experience, although when he published his books many readers knew of his background but not the fact that some of what he mentioned in the stories were classified ideas he had developed himself during the war years.

I could waffle on for a long time about this, but my point is, serious collectors should find a space in their collections for Admiralty Intelligence items. Because essentially these men were Royal Navy, you can find common Royal Navy officer items that once belonged too them. Etched Royal Navy named swords, medals, commission documents........items that are near impossible to fake.