WWI Info Request

[dphillipsd]

Hi Guys,

I need some more help. Having acquired some more family history 'stuff' I have found out that my Great Grandads brother also fought during WWI, and whilst my Great Grandad survived, his brother died. From what I have been able to find out his name was Frederick Harries, and he fought for the Kings Royal Rifles.

Having searched the commonwealth war graves site I have only found one Federick Harries (If anyone can confirm this I would be grateful):
<TABLE class=datatable cellSpacing=1 cellPadding=2 width="97%" align=center border=0><TBODY><TR id=tr_name><TD vAlign=top align=left width="30%">Name:</TD><TD id=td_name>HARRIES</TD></TR><TR id=tr_initials><TD vAlign=top align=left width="30%">Initials:</TD><TD id=td_initials>F E M</TD></TR><TR id=tr_nationality><TD vAlign=top align=left width="30%">Nationality:</TD><TD id=td_nationality>United Kingdom</TD></TR><TR id=tr_rank><TD vAlign=top align=left width="30%">Rank:</TD><TD id=td_rank>Second Lieutenant</TD></TR><TR id=tr_regiment><TD vAlign=top align=left width="30%">Regiment:</TD><TD id=td_regiment>King's Royal Rifle Corps</TD></TR><TR id=tr_unittext><TD vAlign=top align=left width="30%">Unit Text:</TD><TD id=td_unittext>12th Bn.</TD></TR><!-- <tr> <td vAlign="top" align="left" width="30%">Force:</td> <td id="td_force"></td> </tr>--><TR id=tr_death><TD vAlign=top align=left width="30%">Date of Death:</TD><TD id=td_death>26/02/1917</TD></TR><TR id=tr_type><TD vAlign=top align=left width="30%">Casualty Type:</TD><TD id=td_type>Commonwealth War Dead</TD></TR><TR id=tr_grave><TD vAlign=top align=left width="30%">Grave/Memorial Reference:</TD><TD id=td_grave>V. H. 12.</TD></TR><TR id=tr_cemetery><TD vAlign=top align=left width="30%">Cemetery:</TD><TD id=td_cemetery>A.I.F. BURIAL GROUND, FLERS </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

Now I was wondering if anyone could tell me how I could request his service record. From the national archives I was able to get this persons medal card index, but have not been able to find his record.

Also, the article specifies he died at Delville Wood. However, this shows him as dying in 1917. Could anyone provide some information as to where the Kings Royal Rifles was fighting at this time.

Thanks in advance.

[dphillipsd]

Full name: Harries, Frederick Ebenezer Melville

[dphillipsd]

From his medal record it appears as though he didnt receive any, if I am correct:

[Greeves]

Krrc

It would appear that his MIC is blank - perhaps, as he was KIA, no medals were ever claimed on his behalf? Just a guess, I'm sure another forumite has a better (ie more informed) answer than that.

As for information on the 12th (Service) Battalion, KRRC: it was formed at Winchester on September 21st, 1914 and was attached to the 60th Brigade, 20th (Light) Division for the duration.

I got the above information from the following sources:

20th (Light) Division

KRRC 1914-18

Hope this is useful.

Geoff

[yellow]

The officers papers for F E M Harries are not held by the National Archives. The papers for F Harries are there but my guess this is another man (WO 339/49615). Officers always give all of their names upon commission. This could however be a catalogue mistake by the Archives.

I suggest you obtain the Regimental history of the KRRC for more details. There may even be a Battalion history.

Steve.

[leigh kitchen]

Very much not my strong subject, but the entry refering to "Disch" (or similar) would indicate that he was discharged on the date shown (the one on which he actually died) perhaps entered in error for "died" which would be used to indicate death presumed from that date.
The entry bottom left is hard to make out, but it's around that area of the card that the date of first entry into theatre was noted, with a number code (1, 2, 3 etc) indicating the theatre - the relevant one here for France & Flanders would be "1".
The entry beginning "NW" looks like a disembarkation roll reference number.
References to locations like Delville Wood as the place of death can be misleading, it seems that in the absence of anything else for miles around then a landmark such as the nearest patch of brick dust that used to be a village or town, or a few tree stumps that used to be a wood would be referred to as the only identifiable place in a sea of mud, however distant from the actual scene of death.
"Officers Died" shows him as Temporary 2nd Lieutenant with names & date of death as already stated. Noted as "KIA", no personal details such as place of birth, enlistment, no decorations listed.

[dphillipsd]

Hi Leigh,

The word 'disch' is actually the date he died on, in this case 26/2/1917. The entry in the bottom reads: NW/6/22639. Bottom left the numbers 10322 are present.

I have confirmed that this is my relative. He left South Africa to fight for the British in WWI with the KRRC as already said.

[yellow]

Very common for victorian soldiers to be discharged dead. Havent seen this on a WW1 MIC before.

Steve.

[Greeves]

David, if you check The Naval and Military Press they have a copy of the regimental history during the Great War. Just type the product code 6522 into the search bar at the top of the page and it should come up. It's listed at GBP 20.00 right now and has a list of officers KIA.

[yellow]

Temp. 2nd Lt. F. E. M. Harries to Be temp. Lt. 11 Feb. 1917.

[dphillipsd]

Thans guys for the info. Steve, may I ask where you got that info from?

Also is it possible he had medals awarded but not recorded due to his death?

[yellow]

You should check the medal roll at the Nationals Archives to see if he was awarded medals.

Unless you can do it yourself you should hire a private researcher. They wont charge you a lot for this info, around £3.

Steve.