2 LRDG Badges

[nzef1940]

Two LRDG badges (ex NZ) for review please, one a gold plated sweethearts badge the other a well worn and relugged/repaired badge.

[nzef1940]

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[Greg B]

Hi Mike,

Nice been there badges, looking closely at the more worn/polished example on the left I'm of the oppinion it looks to have been an officer example as it shows remnants of a darkened finish. The one on the right appears to have had a gold wash at some time or is it just the lighting?

Greg

[nzef1940]

Thanks Greg

The badge on the right has been gold plated (a while ago) and given as a sweethearts badge the plating is wearing off, you can also see the wee attachment for a safety chain.

[Jack Dutton-Roberts]

I'm going to stick my neck out and say I don't like either of them.

The one on the left looks like a pretty common reproduction. That "wear" on the front isn't that, it has been filed down to give the appearance of wear and also to get rid of the raised dots that appear between the inner and outer circles AND the outer ring which can be a bad sign. This looks nothing like any original example with provenance I have seen.

The one on the right appears to be a more recent reproduction that has been tarted up with a "gilt" finish. The overall quality of this (and the other one) is very poor. Despite these badges often being made locally during WW2 the quality was far superior to this. The LRDG letters are far too regular and the overall appearance is of a modern machine made badge. The scorpion's tail touches the leg which a common feature of these reproduction pieces.

Unless you have rock solid provenance, I can't be convinced.

[Greg B]

Hi Jack,

I dont no how many with provanance you have had through your hands but I have most definately had a few through mine with respect. The two shown by Mike are not of the condition I normally collect but there are details still exposed that I like without giving to much away......and I say that with a fair bit of confidence.

Many of the English & Afican examples that I have seen are comparable to the quality to the NZ 1st type early cast examples, and the 2nd type badges that were supplied to the Kiwi's later on tended to be struck. These 2 appear to be of the 1st type IMO. The basic shape stayed the same they just wern't finished to the same degree as the later ones.

Please note Jack I got my cast and struck time frames round the wrong way...just edited it now.


Cheers
Greg

[Jack Dutton-Roberts]

Hey Greg

Thanks for the additional input. I've only ever had two of these, neither with provenance, I admit. I'm sure they were original, infact I was convinced, however, with these I'd always have a doubt at the back of my mind unless I had some solid provenance.

I guess I just don't like these. But I'm probably wrong.

Thanks
Jack

[Greg B]

Jack, I hear what you are saying and LRDG badges because of there scarcity will always raise concerns. Especially when the condition of badges like these two do not lean to being one lookers.
And that is often reflected in the prices compared to the supperb examples.

In Brendon O' Carrol's Book Kiwi Scorpians he referrs to the first types tended to being cast and of a lesser quality and the second type being struck and much nicer.

As these were all hand finished I guess that quality will varie between badges but certain details dont.

And because of that quality it does open a door for the fakers and it is apparent that more are coming out of the wood work. It used to be just association badges being reworked and refined and the odd very poor attempt of a copy.

You certainly cant beat one direct from the vet .

Now shall we talk LRP Badges thats a whole different story again

[Greg B]

Heres a pic of the fairly common fake that you mentioned of the tail touching the leg but also the front leg touchs the inner frame. Mikes Badge on the right does look like the tail is touching the rare leg but I think it is just the angle of the photo...Mike can probably confirm this. There are some collectors that like these badges...I certainly dont.

Also compare the Letters, no remnants of grooves in the pincers, leggs are wrong, body/head are wrong



Greg

[castagain]

Greg B, yes please talk about LRP badges. Origin, use, examples?

[Greg B]

Greg B, yes please talk about LRP badges. Origin, use, examples?

The LRP Badge was an unofficial silver diestruck badge created in early 41 for the all New Zealand Long Range Patrol members. 90 were manufactured and then the die was destroyed . Initialy it was guilded but the wash wore of fairly quickly and most known examples only exhibit very small amounts of wash left. They were all finished by one man, hallmarked and have beautifull detail.

It was worn sometimes on the hat while on base or on leave but most were sent home to wifes / girlfriends and worn as a sweetheart badge.

I have only ever had in my hands one 100% original and named example. Direct from the family and currently owned by friend and fellow forum member NZRIC.

Although I have detailed pics I will leave it up to him if he choose to show it here.

Greg

[castagain]

Fascinating, thanks for the description. Regards, castagain

[nzef1940]

Thanks Greg and no the rear legs are not attached to the tail, I am more than happy with both. Not pristine examples but I love them for that very 'been there' reason, ancient brasso residue and all.