Repros in general

[Kelly w]

Well I disagree but whatever. I meant to say that money loss threads are in entire WAF forums, not just this forum.

[SprogCollector]

Well I disagree but whatever. I meant to say that money loss threads are in entire WAF forums, not just this forum.

I would certainly agree that many have lost money on fakes, particulary those in Third Reich collecting community. I just happen to believe that the majority of the losses occur when items are purchased without the buyer fully knowing what they're buying.

The ability to debate, opine, and ultimately agree or (respectfully) disagree is one of the finer points of this site.

[Kelly w]

And forums like this do great to help inform collector's.

Now we just have to figure out how to stop the bad seller's that don't send out paid items, or send a pkg out filled with only newspapers, or who don't refund money when item returned etc.

[SprogCollector]

And forums like this do great to help inform collector's.

Now we just have to figure out how to stop the bad seller's that don't send out paid items, or send a pkg out filled with only newspapers, or who don't refund money when item returned etc.

Wholeheartedly agree!

[Anthony N]

Welcome aboard Frank
The only problem i have is that you're from Wigan..........only kidding, being born & bred in Widnes i can't ignore decades of Rugby League hostility

I think the hostility you have noticed comes from collector fear.

If you do a search on here for Floch fakes you will see that the Iron crosses Floch made years ago were so good that many, many collectors have been "floched".

More recently a long time collector & member of this forum let us know that Floch was selling them as repros to dealers who went straight to their stalls and sold them as originals at a large mark up.
I'm sure many crosses have come back to the same dealers after years & fooled them.

However, this is not Floch's fault, but many people ask why he made them so damn good & didn't mark them in some way as a repro.

It is a fascinating discussion & i'm glad you started it.

[pegasus-drive]

Welcome aboard Frank
The only problem i have is that you're from Wigan..........only kidding, being born & bred in Widnes i can't ignore decades of Rugby League hostility

I think the hostility you have noticed comes from collector fear.

If you do a search on here for Floch fakes you will see that the Iron crosses Floch made years ago were so good that many, many collectors have been "floched".

More recently a long time collector & member of this forum let us know that Floch was selling them as repros to dealers who went straight to their stalls and sold them as originals at a large mark up.
I'm sure many crosses have come back to the same dealers after years & fooled them.

However, this is not Floch's fault, but many people ask why he made them so damn good & didn't mark them in some way as a repro.

It is a fascinating discussion & i'm glad you started it.

If I am honest I have never seen wigan play.I used to play rugby union and have never understood the rules of league.
I am watching this debate with great interest,and I am very pleased with how friendly and educated it is.
Coming from both sides of the coin so to speak as a collector who has started to make copies of items from my collection and a few odd bits that other people have asked me to have ago at as well.
The denison smocks in paticular have been an interesting project.While I beleive that my repros are good there are enough clues that they are not original that a special mark is not yet necessary.The studs are the main give away, they are marked Newey but they are different.
But to risk the wrath !!!
I have enough unused original Newey studs and NOS lighting zips to make 5 smocks.
If I made those smocks up I would have to mark those in some way to differentiate them from originals.So my plan is I will only do them for my own use for all the reasons that have been mentioned in this thread.But also the studs and zips were SO expensive,to make it commercial I would have to charge similar money to buying an orginal smock.It would more than double the cost of my smocks,and once they are gone thats it.
That said I will no doubt die some day and what will become of the collection then.So what would you suggest that would make collectors and re-enactores both happy or is this just not possible.

Many thanks for the friendly welcomes.
Frank

[lnijherald]

The Denison smock shown is a good quality replica. There's nothing wrong with that, either for reenactors or as a gap filler.
I'm sure that they are not identical and that some details such as zipper and press studs brands and labels are easy give aways.

Do your homework, or get burned.

Luc

[Adam H]

The obvious answer would be for all these people that like wearing uniforms, and digging and sleeping in holes to join the army like the rest of us. They even give you all the kit for free, feed you and pay you to do it.

Then no repros would be required...except by collectors of fakes / "hole fillers" which never really made sense to me in any case.

I've often wondered if, someday, someone will be reenacting me

[kammo man]

Adam .
It is impossible to join the British Army of the 1940s .
owen

[kapitein]

repro

Nothing against repro's as there is a demand for reenactors, what I would like to see is that manufacturers stamp their kit with the words repro in it!
This will make collecting of original stuff easier and it will make selling repro stuff as original kit impossible for those who want to fool other collectors.
my 2 cents
kapitein

[SprogCollector]

I've often wondered if, someday, someone will be reenacting me

I've asked the same thing. I figure my kit from the 'big war' (1st Gulf War) might actually be worth something in another 10-20 years! I'll be ready to sell my "ultra-rare chocolate-chip BDUs" by then! Maybe even my ultra-pimpy desert parka!

[Kelly w]

I've asked the same thing. I figure my kit from the 'big war' (1st Gulf War) might actually be worth something in another 10-20 years! I'll be ready to sell my "ultra-rare chocolate-chip BDUs" by then! Maybe even my ultra-pimpy desert parka!

Hey whats a good website for info on first gulf war and veterans. It sorta is the forgotten war now.

[Kelly w]

I think ebay should not allow the sale of fakes of any kind. That will put a damper on their crap.

I can't buy a fake Gucci watch or fake Versace hand bag for the wife on ebay.

[pegasus-drive]

I think ebay should not allow the sale of fakes of any kind. That will put a damper on their crap.

I can't buy a fake Gucci watch or fake Versace hand bag for the wife on ebay.

Who is to decide what is fake or not on ebay ?

Or do you mean all repros should not be allowed ?

Cheers
Frank

[force136]

Repromania

Hello Frank

I do not just look at this from a collector/reincarnator perspective but also from the perspective of institutions set up to educate the public about material culture and history in general. From a museum perspective what many repro artists are doing is wrong. Ya, repro's have been around for ever, so what? what is that supposed to mean? murderers and drug dealers have been around forever too. I just don't get the point there? Not to litterally compare it to something of that severity but ya stuff goes on. I think what Frank has not heard is that there is a desire for items made to look TO GOOD, to be MARKED AS SUCH. What is there about that you do not understand? Not just for collectors but also the largely ignorant people that work in military related museums ( OK I know there are knowledgable people working in a FEW museums out there, but lets face it, few are ever hired in the military museum field because of their knowledge of material culture). I know our Canadian War Museum collection of 1CPB insignia is about 60-70% repro.

Now, how can we prevent that? MARK YOUR ITEMS! I suppose if someone was to lose here, it should be the reincarnators. If they can't stand an ink stamp on the inside pockets and the garment itself stating REPRO, then too bad. As for you repro artists, why is that so hard to do and even more importantly - HARD TO UNDERSTAND? Because all that leads to are people wondering about your motives.

From a museum perspective, there are already repro parachutist trousers in museum collections and smocks, cap badges etc. etc. due to a history of people making things for the SOLE INTENT BUT TO DECEIVE. I come to that conclusion because it is obviously something you should know how to do. If you can dye a smock, you can obviously mark it so the mark can't be removed.

In short, if you want the respect of many on this forum, make an effort to properly mark your items as REPRO. I just don't understand why there is an argument here.

PS- I dont collect British Airborne so this is not someone worried about the value of his collection.

The other thing about SOME repro artists that bothers me is the fact that they turn off collectors from writing reference books. If you spent 30 years collecting and all of a sudden decided to research what you have and put a book together, shouldn't you be able to do that without some knob somewhere faking everything you strived over the years to find? I mean some of us could really help up and coming collectors with our knowledge and our collections. However you can't because you know some idiot is going to try and match your images as closely as they can under the excuse that they are intended for reinactors. I have done my best to add all I know to my books but in certain cases I have refused to add information to protect what I own but also the collections of friends and institutions. YES they have invested in it not only collectors but you have as well with your tax dollars. Do you want your local museum dropping your hard earned tax money on a good repro? In other ways collectors and institutions just want to RESPECT the material culture of veterans.

So I would just like to know why it is so impossible for people who make this stuff to mark it in such a way as to tell future generations what it really is?

Ken

I've asked the same thing. I figure my kit from the 'big war' (1st Gulf War) might actually be worth something in another 10-20 years! I'll be ready to sell my "ultra-rare chocolate-chip BDUs" by then! Maybe even my ultra-pimpy desert parka!