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    #1

    Help w/ David Irving book opinions

    I completely understand the controversy regarding Irving, however I just finished reading "The Trail of the Fox" and found it to be very well researched and generally a good book. Maybe the only thing that is somewhat controversial in the book would be the accusation, seemingly well documented by Irving, that the anti-hitler resistance was partially responsible for the slow D-Day response by the Germans.

    Now on to my question. In your opinion are any of the biographies written by him worth a read and not total b.$.? What about Dresden? His fatality numbers might be exaggerated, but is the rest worth a read? I think I'll pass on Hitler's War cause it sounds like a pro-nazi mess.
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    #2
    Anything written by Irving is a waist of time. I wouldn't buy any works by him , if for no other reason than not putting any royalty money in his pocket.
    He would do the world a favor if he would eat crap, howl at the moon and then die.

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      #3
      Point taken. If it makes you feel any better, used books don't pay royalties.

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        #4
        So far I have just read the Dresden book. Don't know what all the fuss is about - he admits that all the casualty numbers are estimates - bodies were so totally destoyed there was no way to count them. These is a lot of anti-Nazi stuff also, like their use of slave labor, mass executions and the evil minded Dr Goebbels. His website is a bit much sometimes, but a least his books have a different point of view. Let's face it - there's no 100% purely objective historian.

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          #5
          Originally posted by BrianK View Post
          . Let's face it - there's no 100% purely objective historian.
          I more than agree...

          No human, historian or otherwise is ever, purely objective.
          I am misquoting , but Historian Carlo Ginzburg wrote to his critics who felt he may have lost some objectivity said "not even a tally sheet (reciept) is objective..."

          nothing written by man is objective, no matter how much one may try or what station in life they occupy, historian, police officer, judge, Holy man, etc

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            #6
            Irvings books are all worth a read .Yes depending on your own political you might see a slant towards the right but this happens with all political and historical writings.I have found Nuremberg agreat read well researched and shocking in many areas .Do not ignore Hitlers War to many this work defines the person and the era more completely than any other work of its type.Dont be influenced by others opinions who havnt read these books read them yourself only you can decide

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              #7
              Thanks guys. I'll take a look on eBay for cheap copies.

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                #8
                you should try here first a lot more bargins than e-bay
                http://www.abebooks.co.uk/search/kn/History+Military
                Best Jamie

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                  #9
                  I wonder how many people there are out there who criticize him till the cows come home, yet have never read one of his books.

                  Comment

                    #10
                    i have several and have enjoyed each one ,each one to his own i guess

                    Comment

                      #11
                      Originally posted by Shawn Rawls View Post
                      Thanks guys. I'll take a look on eBay for cheap copies.
                      His body of work (at least a substantial part of it) is available for free download from Irving/Publisher here: http://www.fpp.co.uk/books/index.html

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                        #12
                        Irving´s thesis on the slowness of the response on D-Day is spot on. There is ample evidence that Speidel was one of the chiel culprits in hindering German defence and possible got rewarded in later life by a high Nato command.

                        As for death toll in Dresden, Irving´s figures are higher than the official figures, but a couple of years back a former East German historian Wolfgang Schaarsmidt published his in depth study on the subject and he lists a death toll figure even higher than Irving´s. Schaarsmidt does emphasize the fact that the true body count with accuracy even down to ten thousand is impossible to prove as the chaos in Dresden prevented the preparation of adequate documentation.

                        I have not read the above book but the details were given in an in-depth review of the book in Finnish professional military journal.

                        Comment

                          #13
                          Dear Shawn, I just finished a contemporary history book in German entitled, "Verrat in der Normandie" (Betrayal in Normandy). It deals exclusively with how members of the German army staff thoroughly sabotaged preparations to resist the Allied invasion even down to the junior command level. A day or two before D-Day for example, coastal artillery batteries received orders to remove the optical sights from heavy guns and ship them rearward for cleaning and adjustment. The gunners had to fire at the U.S. fleet with open sights during the initial landings. The book is heavily documented and filled with information like this. It almost gives the impression that the German leadership in France was in the employ of the U.S. Army. There is a lot of information in German literature that is never translated for the Anglo-Saxon market, unfortunately.

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                            #14
                            I read "The Trail of the Fox" years ago and enjoyed it.

                            Many authors of secondary history have had their works receive contrasting views. I for one do not like the writings of Charles Whiting. And I heard S. Ambrose almost lost his Phd for embellishing his works.

                            Then there is historyography. The study of history as it is written throughout different times. Just imagine the differences in a history of WW2 written in the United States during the 1950's as compared to one written during the anti war movement of the 1960s-70s.

                            I prefer to read primary source history. But, even those can be different. Such as a diary written at the time or the events written from memory many years after the war.

                            If you like an author read their works. But, I agree it is difficult to support an argument against any author if you are unwilling to read their books. Checking out a book from a library or borrowing a book from a friend is an easy way to read an authors work without the feeling that you are contributing to their royalties.

                            Comment

                              #15
                              One comment: I wrote that Schaarsmidt is a former East German author. I was mistaken. What the original reviewer wrote is that his book is based on extensive research in the former East German archives.

                              Richard, is the book you referred to authored by Friedrich Georg or Heinz Schmolke? Both have written on the same topic and both book titles have the words "Verrat in Normandie" in their titles.

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