LW pilot Gottfied Dulias

[TMurray]

I thought this thread from 12 OClock High should be posted, there are serious doubts as to the credibility/validity of claims made by this gentleman who attended SOS 2007.

Re: Gottfried Dulias

<HR style="COLOR: #d1d1e1" SIZE=1><!-- / icon and title --><!-- message -->Dear XXX,


although I have followed this thread from time to time so far I did not feel inclined to enter the discussion as I simply don't have the time to dive any deeper in this matter for instance by contacting the BA at Aachen Kornelim******252;nster to check the personal file of said Leutnant Dulias. And quite frankly from what I can see on this thread it doesn't trigger any bit of of interest to spend my time looking for information on a Lt. Dulias.

From what I have gathered so far I can only offer my personal and private opinion and that is that I don't believe a word of the "career" of this Leutnant; may be he was with the Luftwaffe and even JG 53 as some part of the ground staff and may be he was a Russian POW but so far I have found no piece of information that would lend any credibility to his story.

Having spoken to many former fighter pilots in my time it strikes me that in his account "Lt." Dulias never mentions any names of his Kommandeur, his Staffelkapit******228;n, his Kaczmarek or his close friends. Nor does he become specific about the unit he flew with - I can hardly remember any of the veterans I have spoken with in the past who didn't recall what Staffel he belonged to because the Staffel was their - if I may put it this way - home and family.

Then it strikes me that the locations where he - according to his story - saw combat do not really match with JG 53. No part of JG 53 was ever stationed at Aachen and it would be very odd to name Aachen instead of the Feldflugpl******228;tze and Einsatzh******228;fen from which III./JG 53 did actually operate during this time. There were other prominent places closer to the respective airfields. North of Budapest doesn't convince me either. If he were with that unit he must have been first with III./JG 53 and later with I./JG 53. I don't know of many pilots who were posted in this direction during this time.

Two Spitfires in the West without any further information - how to comment on that. Three I-16 Ratas in the East in January / February 1945 seems totally unbelieveable and as such was hardly a question of mis-identification; if it were a case of the latter, then other pilots of I./JG 53 would also have claimed Ratas around this time which in fact they didn't. Or were those Ratas reserved for Lt. Dulias ?

So at the end of the day to me it all appears to be a badly pieced together fabricated "combat career" the like of which we have seen before. The reaction of "Leutnant" Dulias not to enter into this dicussion and not to offer any tangible proof for his story doesn't really add to his credibility. But, again, this is just my personal point of view and I would not have any problem to make my excuses to Mr. Dulias if he were able to give appropriate substance to his extraordinary exploits.

All the best

Jochen Prien

and abit more ...

fiurther to my recent message I would like to add that during my work on the history of JG 53 I have never come across anybody who mentioned a Lt. Dulias; I have spoken to Hans Ring about him and he too could only state that he had never heard of a German fighter pilot of that name nor that he had any documentary trace that a Lt. Dulias ever claimed to have shot down a British or Russian a/c, be it with JG 53 or any other unit.

Jochen Prien

[J Melvin]

Interesting topic. Let's step lightly, though. There are sensitivities involved here.

[TMurray]

Okay, I have scoured the OKL Fighter Claims Lists for both the Ostfront and Reich, West & Sudfront for the period August-December 1944. There are no recorded claims for a Gottfried Dulias of JG53. There was Feldwebel Gottfried Dietze (sometimes misspelt Dotze) with 5 claims, however, he flew with 1./JG26 much earlier being wounded on 31.05.1942 in the crash of his FW190.

[TMurray]

Having checked several different lists of Luftwaffe aces with 5 claims, there is a Gottfried Dietze as per previous message but he definitely flew with JG 26. I would have to conclude the claim of Mr Dulias to be an ex Luftwaffe ace with JG53 'Pik As' as unsubstantiated.

[Alan Smith]

Very interesting analysis of Herr Dulias' claims. I noticed his photo in several other threads in the WA forum, where various collectors eagerly stood beside him to have their photo taken with a "real" WWII German pilot.

I found the guy's dress in the photos to be suspicious - wearing a TR period uniform. I've seen lots of vets (mostly U.S. and a very few German) and while most of them would not mind appearing at a public event to talk about their wartime experiences, I simply can not imagine ANY of them showing up dressed in a period constume. Particularly for a German vet, wearing a TR period costume to a public event would seem to be totally out of the question.

Just my thoughts and I'm glad to see that someone has exposed this apparent fraud.

[CWP]

I'm a reenactor. I have seen plenty of real, substantiated veterans (including German veterans) in WWII uniform. It's not out of the question.

[Alan Smith]

Chris,

Thanks for the observation. As I'm not in the reenactor circles, I don't see the same things you do.

Now that you mention it, I can see a German vet dressing up in period costume at a reenacting event, but only because of the "reenactment" theme and everyone else being similarily dressed up.

My experiences are limited to more formal public events where the vets appear to speak with an audience about their wartime experiences. At such events no one would be dressed in period costumes.

I feel sorry for this guy - if he has so few events in his own life to be proud of (military or non-military achivements) that he has to resort to this type of charade to fill his time.

[PANZERPIONIERE]

This is very interesting, I am glad I did not purchase his book at the SOS, I almost did. I would really like to hear more about this.
Steve

[TMurray]

Here is one inconsistency with Mr Dulias' story:

He claims that he shot down a 'Rata' (I-16) on 4.3.1945 whilst flying with JG 53. Unfortunately, the greater majority, if not all, I-16s had been phased out by late 1943. On 5.3.1945, there were two claims made by a Leutnant Gottfried Dietze of 7./JG 26 for Austers near Krefeld (Central West Germany near the Rhine). There is no way any Soviet aircraft would have been operating in this location. This is the closest match I can substantiate.

On another website and thread, contact was apparently made with the Chairman of the traditional JG 53 association, they could find no record of a Dulias serving in JG 53.

[Jean-Loup]

I would be curious to see what is written in his book. It might make a good document to study the mans psychology. Does he even speak German?
I wonder how many other fake veterans have written books, and so on.

[Okrach]

Gottfried Dulias

Hallo, I think I will paste here my two posts I included into another thread. I am LW enthusiast and here is what I found:

Gottfried Dulias - true name, false story

1) True, he was a Luftwaffe flyer (see official photo and look at his cap and rank), however he has never made it to officer - there had been no officer named Gottfried Dulias (Dullas, Dullias) listed in JG 53 nor in the entire German Luftwaffe.

2) Such name does not figures in 39-45 KIA or MIA list.

3) From the 882 German pilots who scored 5 or more CONFIRMED victories there is no pilot named Gottfried Dulias. 5 confirmed and 1 probable kills would have granted him place in JG 53 history which is not the case (acc. to J. Prien).

4) There is only one pilot with similar name who scored 5 CONFIRMED kills. His name was Gottfried Dietze but he flew with 1./JG 26 as Feldwebel already in 1942 (he got later promoted to officer after being wounded in combat in 1942 - 31. 05. 42. he crashed in his Focke Wulf Fw 190A-2 (WNr. 0125295 )near Arques airbase because of fire in cockpit). After his recovery he came back to flying in 1./JG 26 but on 4th February 1944 he was wounded while in combat with P-47.

5) His story is not logical '
Gottfried had developed an interest in flying and often watched the take-offs and landings practiced by cadets at the nearby Luftwaffe Air-War School #4. He joined the flying program of the Hitler Youth, which was dedicated to pre-military glider training. This was the prerequisite for pilot training in the Luftwaffe. Gottfried earned his “A” and “B” certificates in this way during the period of 1940-1941.
In May of 1943, Gottfried was called to serve in the “Arbeitsdienst” (Labor Force), a pre-military organization mandated for all future soldiers. After a six-month tour of duty building fortifications at the Northwest coast of France, he was finally called to join the Luftwaffe in November of that year.
Gottfried was now 18 years old. Upon completion of a three-month boot camp at Oschatz, Saxony, he entered Air Academy #2 at Berlin-Gatow on February 1, 1944. His training consisted of theoretic training, glider and soaring, and ultimately powered aircraft flight school. This gained Gottfried the long-awaited “C” certificate.'

First ARBEITSDIENST than AUSBILDUNG. Besides, in May 1943 - already trained pilots were sent to expert flying schools and then to units not to work!!! In May 1943 Germany was already in need of pilots!!

Gottfried’s first monoplane was the dual controlled Messerschmitt 108 Taifun. The natural progression from there led him to the legendary Messerschmitt Me109E Emil. During Gottfried’s training in the former front-line fighter, he developed a mechanical failure in one of the landing gear of his plane. After realizing his situation, the flight instructor radioed his choices of either bailing out or attempting a landing with only one of his wheels down and locked. Gottfried opted for the landing and successfully landed the warbird, which sustained minimal damage. This earned Gottfried an honorary commendation.


In EVERY Bf-109 (any German fighter) flight manual or in RLM signed fighter flight safety recommendation stays clear: every NOT-LANDUNG must be done on the belly!!! What is more even on both wheels down - 109 was a tricky plane to land and start!!! I can't see it any flight instructor would have ever recommended unexperienced pilot to land with one wheel down!!!


6) There is no chance I-16 Rata type fighters were spotted in combat in 1945. His claims are simply ridicolus and proves his lack of basic knowledge of his ex-enemies.


7) His book contains no names, dates, places. Every pilot would remember his first confirmed KILL in detail !!! The girl one might forget but not his first aerial CONFIRMED victory!!!

Summarizing it and comparing my list to the cite from Mr. J. Prien one can only say - he is a funny guy who has dreamed his fighter dream for his entire life - a really LOOOONG time. He must really enjoy it beeing an 'ace'

The problem is not many real vets know about him nor they probably care. As You said, it is sad that some enthusiasts 'promoted' this clown whose only real story is that he was a pilot (I wonder if he ever managed to pilot 109 for his own! or simply keeps on dreaming of it; according to his supernatural abilities concerning landing Emil on one wheel while still in training (SIC!!!!!!!) I really doubt it) and he spent some years in USSR in POW camp.

He keeps showing up on many militaria correlated shows and plays his role. The more interesting thing is that he avoids any confrontation with REAL enthusiasts who might reveal his true 'career'. His age works on his favour but any Luftwaffe enthusiast or historian would have heard of an ace (5-?-1) who scored his unusual victories against Rata fighters in 1945... (probability of such claim (I-16 Rata in 1945) is as realistic as a claim of Bf-109G-14AS shooting down Sopwith Camel in 1945 which pilot bailed out with parachute. These probabilities are equal to zero because... both planes were simply NOT there in that time! (or maybe he shot down the very last three of them? )

Some people easily belive what they hear and some simply want to feel the glympse of beeing a 'celebrity'. In my opinion this chap has many complexes and is pathetic. Besides all of it, I have never heard of nor have I seen any German veteran so eager to pose in the period uniform.

[TMurray]

well done Tomasz

[Okrach]

Completing my gathered information - according to data available 'Lt.' Dulias flew on the Bf-109G-14AS 'yellow' 6 which indicates he was in 3./JG53. In that time, entire Luftwaffe was running short with planes. and pilots did not paints their 'scores' on the tails anymore (or if they did it was sporadical). They simply flew what was available. According to Mr. Dlulias his yellow 6 tail has his Abschussbalken on it what means he has his 'personal' plane...WOW...

The other issue is - how could it be that he does not even mentioned his FAMOUS commanders (Gruppenkommandeure)? I would have been proud to say I was fighting by the unit which commanders (by proxy) were the greatest flyers ever.

(in 1945 3. Staffel being a part of I. Gruppe JG 53 has following Gruppenkommandeure:

Hptm Erich Hartmann (subst.), Februar 1945

Hptm. Helmut Lipfert, 15. Februar 1945 - 17. April 1945)

OKL claims list for 1945 does not mention a single aerial victory claimed by 'lt.' Dulias nor there is a single I-16 rata claim on this list.

All wrong with this guy... But he has balls to made his dreams real.

[Okrach]

Jochen Prien wrote on the other forum concerning same person:

(...) fiurther to my recent message I would like to add that during my work on the history of JG 53 I have never come across anybody who mentioned a Lt. Dulias; I have spoken to Hans Ring about him and he too could only state that he had never heard of a German fighter pilot of that name nor that he had any documentary trace that a Lt. Dulias ever claimed to have shot down a British or Russian a/c, be it with JG 53 or any other unit.

Jochen Prien.

[Okrach]

Well, I believe he has got recently promoted to Oberleutnant! His career continues

More seriously anyone knows if the awards he is wearing are originals (I can ask if he has earned them all?)

According to his 'career' he has joined 3./ JG 53 in the fall of 1944. It is pretty short time to earn frontflugspange in silber (60 flights) I think, if to consider lack of fuel, planes, other materials...