Third Restoration

[MaxxBrunn1938]

Well Zeek as mentioned before I only restore IF and I MEAN IF the items was DICKED with Post War. As for the WW1 I was a mere kid and from what I remember there was no paint on it and it was used as a planter at one time cause there was no liner in it and it had caked on dirt. Now I do have a M35 that was given to me while I was in the military back in the early 80s that has about 65 to 70 % paint (the top is sun burnt showing red )and still has its metal liner with about 20% leather. Story I got from my fellow Squad member was his dad found it in the woods while stationed in Germany durning the late 50s. needless to say I still have it in the same condition....
I was only joking with you on kickin one down. There are a ton of items still out there that were in use by the Slavik countries after the war and the Dicked them up with there paint jobs, these I will restore and if I ever do sell them with inform the buyer that it was restored, unlike some crooks out there that will AGE it for profit.
So I don't want to hear about not having respect , belive me with what I do have in my collection which is a ton of stuff I'm always checkin it for decay . I have an early 1938 NCOs peaked cap that was always in very nice feild use condition that my Great uncle brought back. Now I look at it and see the visor has pebbled in some areas and melted where the chis strap rest and I have no idea what caused it or how to take care of it. All I ever used was a cloth to dust it.

[zeek]

MAX: Never really thought you killed good helmets. We were both streatching the truth. Do you see, how that helmet you got from Germany, hasn't gotten any worse. Most collectors know how to preserve. I too alter helmets. Paint battle scenes on shells. There are plenty of CZ, Norway, Bulgaria repaints to use for what me, you, and Jim do. I like Jim's finished product. Would have liked to see him use a nothing shell, over an original, thats all. PS, when I was a kid, I painted an original German, no decal, black. So I could be the ss man, playing army.

[MaxxBrunn1938]

I would say at least maybe HALF of us did that at one time as a kid back then. I remember you could pick up a Galiator Luftschulzt Helmet at the old Army Navy stores anywhere from $10.00 the $20.00 dollars which we also used to play as a German. ..

Joe

[therifleman]

Personnaly, I believe resotring things like helmets destroys their inherent historical value. Once you slap a new paint job and decal on, it loses that "been there" feel that so many helmets have.

Keeping these things around for as long as possible should be a top priority, in my opinion. I'm 16 years old, and just trying to get into collecting. I see that days have changed, and that things like helmets are no longer as plentiful as they used to be. Prices have skyrocketed (I am still long in the process of mustering funds for my first helmet ). It saddens me to see a fascinating hobby like this being threatend by a market full of fakes, frauds, and unscruplous dealers. For someone like me who looks to continue this hobby, the future does not look extremely bright. Keeping helmets the way they are will not be the hobby's entire saving grace, but it will certainly help. Not only for aspiring collectors like myself, but also for preserving an important period in human history that has gone and passed.

[ChrisCook]

Helmet

Personnaly, I believe resotring things like helmets destroys their inherent historical value. Once you slap a new paint job and decal on, it loses that "been there" feel that so many helmets have.

Keeping these things around for as long as possible should be a top priority, in my opinion. I'm 16 years old, and just trying to get into collecting. I see that days have changed, and that things like helmets are no longer as plentiful as they used to be. Prices have skyrocketed (I am still long in the process of mustering funds for my first helmet ). It saddens me to see a fascinating hobby like this being threatend by a market full of fakes, frauds, and unscruplous dealers. For someone like me who looks to continue this hobby, the future does not look extremely bright. Keeping helmets the way they are will not be the hobby's entire saving grace, but it will certainly help. Not only for aspiring collectors like myself, but also for preserving an important period in human history that has gone and passed.

Let me give you some encouragement, but first off let me say this: You make some excellent points, and it are those such as you that hold the future for this hobby. I also want to commend you on putting together a very cogent argument, it gives me hope to see that compared to some of the youngsters I run into behind the counter at McD's, etc. that can't even communicate....

There is a place for "restored" helmets such as these for entry level and younger collectors who may not have deep pockets, but they are representative examples, and should be built up off a helmet that is beyond hope (already repainted, etc.) I am currently doing a Prewar M16 Transitional helmet because I don't want to shell out the amount of money for a real one, it will look good, but it was off a shell only that had been stripped and painted black, therefore no fear of destroying history....or that "been there" look that you refer to...you're spot on....

I have acquired all of my helmets (with the exception of my Pith Helmets) from local sources. I have several M42 SD Heer helmets, a nice DD M35 helmet Heer, an M40 Heer, and a nice SD Luftwaffe M40. Also, several WWI M16 helmets, they can still be found, but it's not easy. I've never paid more than 195$ for one of my steel helmets, and it's all within the past five years. I'm just as leary of the internet as you, and I agree fakery is a major issue to the future of this hobby. My first recommendation to you is buy the books (Baer, Hicks, etc) before buying the helmets. Good luck with acquiring your first helmet! Chris....

[SteelhelmJim]

21 08 08 - 10:21

What's the difference in these three things?
By John Potter


Conservation generally indicates responsible use of the land (or whatever the subject is) will be made. An example would be tightly controlled and limited logging of an area.

Preservation means to leave things alone.

Restoration means to attempt to restore something to it's original condition. In a natural setting this might mean getting rid of invasive species and replanting what had previously been lost.

These three things cause great controversy in both natural areas and artifact care.
Case in point is an old museum curator joke: "We have the actual hatchet George Washington used to chop down the cherry tree with in our museum. The head has been replaced twice and the handle three times."

[juvatwad]

I guess all of those thousands of paintings and sculptures in museums around the world are almost now worthless and historically insignificant given the amount of resorative upkeep they require.


Ian

[zeek]

"Restoration means to attempt to restore something to it's original condition. In a natural setting this might mean getting rid of invasive species and replanting what had previously been lost. " John Potter quote.

If this is the case. Then few, if any restorations of helmets are ever restored to their original condition.

Original leather took real wool blend felt, under leather. Repro leather has synthetic felt (shows up with black light.

Original decals were of a thin celuloid material. Original Heer had powered glass blended into decal. Was applied with laquer, under and over decal. New repro decals are thin plastic. Most likely have synthetic material to make sparkle. Repro decals are so far off in design, they can be spotted as fake a mile away.

Paint may appear to have original shade. But ends there. Original compounds are far different than modern paints sold for helmet restorations. . Including lead, and a host of other materials not used in repro paint. One of the books I have gives a complete break down of original paints.

I would mention liner band differences here, but Jim did use the original band, split pins and shell. All else is mearly an attempt at capturing the helmets original state. In conclusion. If the attempt is to convert an original helmet to "original restored", then all parts, must be of exact original construction. Other wise its not an "original restoration".

[SteelhelmJim]

It is common for museum curators to preserve, protect, and restore historical artifacts.
If there is more than one of a given artifact, they will sometimes take one and restore it to it's original condition, using the best materials they can come up with.
They will attempt to use the same materials and methods used to create the original artifact.
If this is not possible, they will use the next best thing.