Christ... just stop this argument and make a restoration part of the forum, then nobody can frown upon a helmet being restored, as they can just keep out of that forum part...
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Im against myself restoring items. Just cant bring myself to do it. But Somewhere down the line that helmet could end up at the dump. Just so you know what people think of this stuff....
This was found in a trash heap waiting to go to the dump...Comment
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Originally posted by Elvis View Post
! No doubt a lot of people would find it offensive. Good save, Bill
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Jim, you make some good points, such as...
...and...Originally posted by SteelhelmJim View Post
Originally posted by SteelhelmJim View Post
But this one has me wondering....
I wonder if your low regard for these items as true pieces of history is what compels you to paint over them and turn them into "toys." I mean no disrespect by that. You did a great job with the restoration. But that's all that it will ever be. If you thought it had no real historical significance before, I'm just wondering what value does it hold for you now?Originally posted by SteelhelmJim View Post
BlairComment
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Blair,
I noticed your memorium. My step-son is in Iraq as I write this. He is a turret gunner, doing force protection for convoys. His vehicle is the lead scout vehicle. I speak with him often on Skype.
But to answer your question. For me the helmet I restored has minimal historic value because it has no specific provenance, other than a soldier's name. We don't know if the major rust, few strips of leather, or surface paint occured during or after the war. We cannot tie this helmet to any specific time, place, or event. These are the criteria used by historians and museum curators to determine the historic value or significance of a given object. Not the subjective value given to it by collectors.
I have preserved what is historically present on the helmet. The shell, liner bands, splitpins, and soldier's name. I have restored what was deteriorated, or could not be proven to be wartime: the surface paint. I returned the helmet to near mint condition. As it was when it was first produced. Now I have a nice example of what the helmet looked like when it was new, as well evidence of it having been used in combat by a specific person.
For me, the helmet now becomes a historic object de art. Created by German workers, worn by Uffz. Bode, and restored by me. A combination of past and present, preserved for the future.
I didn't do it for historians or collectors. I did it for me.
When I look at it, my eyes are pleased. I see the history, and see my appreciation of that history. And frankly, in the final analysis, I don't give a damn what others think.
JimComment
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Au contraire, mon petit mouche. If that were true you wouldn't be going on and on and on in at least two threads about the subject. You crave attention and can't stand the fact that others don't think in lock step with you.Originally posted by SteelhelmJim View PostComment
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if you wanted to restore a helmet why didnt you buy one of the MANY post war repainted ones? i myself have a few and they are ideal for restoration as they have already been stripped and thus have no history left on them from the war! the helmet with the name is now worth less then 100 dollars now where as before named with most of the paint and liner it might have been worth 200 odd dollars! the history of this helmet is now gone! i just dont understand why with so so so so SOOOO many un-named lids out there with no original paint or liner someone thought that after surviving 70 years it would be a good idea to ruin a good lid!as for the restoration itself yes they look ok but they do look like repos im afraid! or to put it in war badge terms if you have a zink IAB with all the silver wash gone would you spray paint it silver? no course you wouldn't!!Comment
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Paddy,
Oh c'mon. The helmet in question kicked around for 70 years, and God knows how much of the deterioration occured after the war. And no one is considering the possibility that the paint that remained may have been slapped on it by some kid, playing war with dad's Bring Back. You'd think that this helmet came through a time warp, from 1945 straight to me. It was sold on ebay twice, for a relatively low amount, for God's sake!
Oh, and I forgot to mention that there was no original paint under the hand-applied surface coat. There was on the inside, but not outside. So, what does that imply? You tell me?
I think I just walked into the wrong forum and threw out a bone that some folks here just like to pick at.
JimComment
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Nice job! I consider myself a purist when it comes to helmets, but IMO that helmet was no longer in any kind of collectible condition. It turned out great, and if you are pleased with it, that's what matters. Hell, if I thought I could do that good of a restoration, I'd like to try doing one also,
AndrewComment
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Thanks Andrew, I really appreciate your response.
JimComment
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Again its your helmet. Lets put it this way. If you found an original 150 year old, civil war, confererate sword, in like condition as your helmet. Would you deem it necessary for restoration? Paint blade, handle sheath. Or sand- steel wool everything to briliant shine. Possibly varnish the entire thing, to look real nice. It would look real nice. But if you want real nice, go out and buy repro. That will look even nicer. As far as the original sword, untouched, is far more desirable to collectors and to history. We collectors of today, are only temporary owners to future generations. 150 years from end of ww2, when were all pushing dasies, orignal ww2 helmets, in like condition as yours prior to resto, will certinly be a high priced, high desired item. Restored examples will remain forever as restored examples. Serch my post on restored or art helmets vs originals. I posted 3 original relic helmets in far worse condition than yours was. I do helmet art painting. But wouldn't touch those for the love of money. Especially that I really don't need to sell them. ZeekComment
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If it was a UNION one no I'd leave it alone but a Confererate I'd use it to wack weeds with.Originally posted by zeek View PostComment
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Originally posted by SteelhelmJim View Post
the helmet is a historical piece, because its an "M35" type of helmet produced for the German army pre-war. That fact shows that it is a piece out of history. The name, the few strips of leather shows that it saw combat, and the rust of course happend post war, after the vet took it back to the USA from Europe....have a respect for history no matter what you talk about, a piece of worthless shrapnel or you name it ...by the way, your step son is wearing a German helmet...its all the cause of history....Comment
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Jim,
Nice Job on the restoration...I wouldn't mind having a restored helmet or two.
I think a restoration is a good thing...imagine if somebody else, the non collectors type got ahold of it and painted it chrome, or jet black, or some awful paintjob like that.Comment
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Hemet anger.
Cripes there must be thousands still out there, how many do you wantOriginally posted by coloradocowboy View Post
?Look at how many turn up on the e.stand and at arms fairs.Lets face it this wasn't a shinning example not one I would want.I think he has done a nice job on the restoration and its not as if he is restoring to flog it on as a mint original.I'm doing just the same thing with an M35,M40 and M42 these are all lids without original paint or postwar paint applied,total cost less than a £100Wouldn't post pics on here though wouldn't wont to bring down another s@#tstorm of fury.Regards Hans.
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