Vinigar to clean things?

[Jean-Loup]

I recently tried cleaning a few ground dug things in vinigar, and had very good results for bullets, and a silver (?) medaillon (see post 87 and 88 here http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...=194678&page=6 .) I just diped the things in viniar few minutes, or even a few seconds, and all the grime came off, with no damage being inflicted.
I know with some types of metals, vinigar could inflict damage. Has anyone else used vinigar, and know its limitations and risks?

JL

[chippler]

I have used vinegar before and it did bugger all so I tried toothpaste and that worked very well.

- Chris

[Raven26]

Jean-Loup,

I have enjoyed your other threads. Very good work, and I will send you a PM.

As for the cleaner, depending on what you want to "clean", I have used Tarn X on several metals and have had excellent results without destroying or damaging the items. Rinse well with water. For rust, you may consider using a rust/bluing remover. Soaking the item for different time durations has varying results. However, this will remove paint.

Do a search for Tarn X and rust or bluing remover.

I hope this assists you,

Frank

[Nick B]

Your right on being careful with vinegar we used it to strip Galvanization of some chain mail I had, So it eats zinc very nicely.

Cheers
Nick

[Valter Gorenc]

I'm using vinegar for removing rust from badly rusted ground dug items. I soak the rusted item in vinegar and leave there for a couple of days, removing rust and changing vinegar once or twice a day. I use an old toothbrush to remove losened rust and it works quite fine. After the procedure you have to wash the item with water and dry it carefully.

This SS buckle was completely covered with rust (unfortunately I don't have pics before claning) and now there are only few spots of rust.

[Valter Gorenc]

It looks better in real than on the pics. The prongs can move freely now, but they were "glued" with rust before. The only thing is this somehow strange color, light gray with some brown-yellow tone, and I think it's from the rust's pigment that was dissolved by vinegar. I cleansed it three years ago and didn't tuch ever since, and it doesnt rust at all. You can see there are also a couple of pieces of original paint left, these weren't affected by vinegar.

regards, valter

[Richard]

Vinegar is acetic acid. It is a very dilute version of other acids and so eats away at practically anything but at different rates. It can eat away at metal, rust and even limestone. TarnX is a solution that also removes a slight bit of metal each time it is used. As tarnish is nothing but a layer of the original metal that has become oxidized, each application to remove that tarnish also removes some of the original metal. So even though it may be on a molecular level, each of these will remove some of the original metal.
Richard V

[Jean-Loup]

Thanks for the replies.
I would tend to agree with what Richard said, and so only use chemicals to clean things when they are extremely dirty, and will obviously clean up very nicely like the medaillon I posted did. Without vinigar, or something else, it would have been nearly impossible to clean. Aslo, in the case of the medalion, there was iron rusted onto the silver, and iron having a lower oxidation value then silver (if I remember corectly) the iron was attacked first, without any visible changes being done to the silver. The silver still has what looks like original patine and all. It doesnt look like it was cleaned with any chemicals.

About helmets and other learge items, I usualy dont clean them at all.
JL

[leigh kitchen]

No need to despair if you have no vinegar - tomato ketchup, brown sauce etc work as well.

[Tiger 1]

Why go with an acid instead just simple soap and water to begin with?

With any type of cleaning or preservation work it's always safer to go from the least harsh cleaning agent and to progress from there while carefully observing the affects and results.

Another thing to very seriously consider is that no one mentioned neutralising the object after using acid(vinegar) or othere chemical agents. If this isn't done problems will occur.

Careful out there, good intentions without a clear understanding of why to clean, if at all, what to use, and when to stop have damaged a lot of otherwise good items.

Just some thoughts.

Tony

[Jean-Loup]

Well said Tony. I normaly dont clean things at all, and if I do usualy only use a tooth brush and soap. But as you can see from the picture of the medallion I found, something a bit more powerfull was needed. I believe I latter washed it with soap, to stabalise it as you said.
Though with the small amount of vinigar left, it couldnt do much damage, even with no stabalising...

[Tiger 1]

Though with the small amount of vinigar left, it couldnt do much damage, even with no stabalising...

Thanks Jean-Loup,

On this part we would have to disagree a bit. For instance, a fingerprint left behing on a edged weapon blade will eventually damage it from the very minute acids and salts present on each person's skin. These acids are so delute that we cannot taste them, yet they will do permanent damage.

I understand that the intial condition of the items being cleaned can vary greatly but care still needs to be taken none the less to neutralize any chemical agent we put on a collectable. This careful frame of mind should be foremost with collectors so we don't inadvertantly cause any further damage.

All the best,

Tony.

[Jean-Loup]

With the condition ground dug items are usualy in, you can not realy compare them to a mint dagger blade. If you had a ground dug dagger, I think it would be rather immune to finger prints; and even if you did manage to make a fingerprint, it would just be one drip in the sea of damage; not like on a mint dagger where it would be the only drip of damage.

But you are still right, and care should be taken to neutralise any chemicals used to clean an item.
JL

[Tiger 1]

JL,

I think fundimentally we understand what each other, we're talking about the same thing from different perspectives.

It's always good to remember the medical Physician's creed to "Do no harm". when it comes to collectables.

All the best,

Tony

[Jean-Loup]

Although I like things salty, this dog tag was just to messy, so I decided to clean it with vinigar. I let it sit for several minutes, then brushed it with a tooth brush. I am rather pleased of the result. It still looks salty, but is much nicer then before. It used to be a relic; now it is very presentable!