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**DavidM** · 03-07-2006, 02:31 PM

Hello George

Having looked at your photo I would suggest that this is one occasion when you really do need to take action, as the rust appears to be getting a grip on the iron core.

I have only ever had one EK that required remedial treatment but this what I did.

Using a soft toothbrush and a mild solution of warm soapy water I rubbed the entire core over until all the lose rust had gone. As you can imagine, this also removed any dirt and lose debris. Using paper kitchen towel I dried the cross and immersed it into a silver dip solution, (the one I use here in the UK is Goddards Silver Dip - a none abrasive dip), for about 3 minutes. After removing it from the silver dip, rinse in clear, cold water and then throughly dry using paper kitchen towels, shaking the cross and a hair drier. Finally gently rub all over with a long term silver polishing cloth.

As I say, I have only had to do this once, but in my case it worked. For whatever reason the silver dip had a positive effect on the iron core, as well as bringing the rims up really nicely! It may be worth a try if the rust is literarily eating the core away.

Good luck, and if you do try some remedial treatment, whether this or something else, could you post the 'after' pictures.

Regards
David

**Daniel Murphy** · 03-11-2006, 08:08 PM

George,
The rust came from under the frame and a surface treatment will not work. You need to kill the rust that may be on both sides of the core under the frame. I reccomend that you get a high quality penetrating oil. Then place the cross, exposed core up and pool some of it on the core. This makes sure there is enough oil to get to ALL parts of the core, front and back. A few hours may do it or leave it overnight. This will kill the rust and leave it dormant. When you believe that is done use an absorbant such as a paper towel, turn the cross upside down and try to get as much of the penetrating oil out. Then place the cross over a low to medium heat source for a day or two, to help evaporate as much of the remaining pentrating oil as possible. You need to get the temporary oil out so it can be replaced with the long term oil. When you believe it is ready then apply a high quality gun oil and try to get it to soak in under the frame as well. By chance, if there is any remaining active rust under the frame this will keep it from making a comeback. Pentrating oil only, would evaporate eventually and may put the cross at risk later on. Once the gun oil has soaked in as much as possible, remove the remainder as above. I would NOT use a brush

or any type of abrasive item

on the core. The idea is to kill the rust, make sure it stays dormant and preserve as much of the original finish (paint) as possible. I would then check the cross again periodically and apply a light coat of gun oil if neccesary. This will preserve the cross and keep it in the best possible condition without damaging it further.
Dan Murphy

**Sal Williams** · 03-13-2006, 12:24 AM

Hi George,
I think this will work best for you. I used it on my blades and it is working well. Here is a link to a very informative thread.

http://wehrmacht-awards.com/forums/s...ust+protection

Best, Sal

**Daniel Murphy** · 03-13-2006, 01:41 AM

With all due respect, we are talking apples and oranges here. Most swords can be disassembled to to get at rust/ corrosion under the hilt and both sides of the blade are exposed. An Iron Cross cannot be treated the same way. You have to have something that can get under the edge of the frame and then coat the hidden back of the core as well. If you do not "kill" all of the rust, it will come back with a vengeance. Most cores on TR EK1's are thin stamped steel. (I also have a Zimmerman "20 marked EK1 and I know the core is stamped because mine has been bent into a convex cross by the soldier. You cannot bend a solid steel or iron cored EK1.) You already probably have decades of rust that has been hidden and slowly eating away. If you do not stop it 100% it will eat completely through the thin core and turn a nice piece into a relic condition item. The only way to get at it and kill that rust is with oil. Preferably thin oil so that it will pentrate to get all of the rust, then followed up by a thicker oil for long term protection.

As far as the silver dip, there is an old saying "The road to H*ll is paved with good intentions". Even if it did penetrate to the back of the core, it is not going to remove the rust or make it dormant. Then you follow it up with water, dry it out, and you are still in the same boat. The rust is still there. "I rubbed the entire core over until all the lose rust had gone." If you have to do this, you already know the dip will not get rid of the rust.

George, It is your cross. You have to make the decision. I have been collecting, restoring and preserving militaria for over 35 years. I would not suggest this to you unless I had already done it before. If you make the right decision, you will still have a valuable piece than can be passed on to future generations. Otherwise, you may have a piece of junk, that has little value.
Dan Murphy

**George Stimson** · 03-13-2006, 09:20 AM

Thank you for all of the suggestions, gentelmen. As the cross even seems to have gone a bit downhill since I started this thread I will be making a decision soon. And I will let you know what I decide to do, and the results thereof!

Attached Files

20ek1again.jpg (126.5 KB, 343 views)

**Sal Williams** · 03-13-2006, 12:01 PM

Hi Daniel,
I was talking about Rich Morans suggestion. It is a penetrating oil. It is at the later part of the thread I posted a link to. I would imagine one would get the same excellent results as with a dagger by soaking the EK in the oil. The advantage of that product, as I understand it, is that it is meant to penetrate the pores of metals.

best, Sal

**Sal Williams** · 03-23-2006, 10:52 PM

So how did it turn out?

**Tiger 1** · 03-24-2006, 01:43 PM

George,

For what ever it's worth. There are several ways of stopping rust.

In the gunsmithing trade there is a process of blueing that uses a deliberately induced rusting process. As a matter of fact the Germans used this process on many of their prewar Luger pistols and Mauser 98 rifles. It is known as the Zischang(sp?) process.

The rusting was caused by the application of an acidic liquid formula to the metal and excellerated in a damp box to provide humidity.

This rust was then boiled in clean water to 'kill' any further rusting and to convert the reddish rust into an inactive balck oxide. The oxide was then carded and the process repeated several times to get the desired color. The surface was then sealed with an oil or a wax.

Sorry for being long winded here, but the pertinant fact is that the active rust is 'killed' by boiling it in clean water.

Futher info can be found in Angier's ' Browning and Bluing of Firearms' or something close to that title. You can get a copy from Brownell's the gunsmithing supply house in Iowa.

Good luck,

Tony

**Matt Starr** · 07-28-2006, 09:11 AM

x

**George Stimson** · 07-28-2006, 01:14 PM

Right now I'm just keeping an eye on it. The deterioration seems to have slowed down considerably, if it hasn't stopped altogether. I did knock off a little bit of the flaking paint in the upper right corner of the upper arm, but other than that I haven't tried any of the remedies suggested here.
Here is a pic of it taken about five minutes ago.

Attached Files

rustingzimm.jpg (121.8 KB, 188 views)

**Matt Starr** · 07-28-2006, 03:10 PM

wow,
the red colour baffles me!

**wh014d4394** · 07-28-2006, 03:25 PM

hello sir if it was my baby i would strip the cross down kill all the rust then simply put her back together again job done but that's just me i don't want to scare you but you wont have an iron cross to look at in the next five years

**Matt Starr** · 07-28-2006, 03:44 PM

x

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