Dagger Preservation

[Wizard]

I believe that once the beads hold enough moisture, they are actually useless.

For my most prized dagger, I actually had a airtight box made out of cedarwood. Inside the box I have placed dessicant beads as an extra protection. So far, it's been great.

[Edgar Estrada]

Hello,
I have a couple of questions, do you ever use Renaissance Wax on helmets and buckles?
Regards,
Jody

Please, can someone answer that question?

Thanks for the tips about daggers.

Edgar

[Haydn]

In or Out

On the 'in' or 'out' question - I once put an army dagger back into the scabbard. The blade was a plated beauty. When putting in back into the scabbard I felt a slight, and I mean slight resistance, I took it back out and found that the plating had been scratched. It was not a pretty sight seeing a grown man cry. After that, once I receive them and take them out - they never go back in. I wipe them with Ren wax and presently store them in knife bags. I have seen daggers displayed on stands like those bought from Bill Shea and personally, I think it's nicer to see the blade in all it's glory. I just don't think you see enough when they are displayed in their scabbards.

I would just hate for someone to replicate my damaged blade.

[Tiger 1]

Hi guys,

Some thoughts.

Scabbards are made to protect the blade. There's different schools of thought here. An exposed blade will collect dust however minute. This dust will attract and hold moisture. I let the scabbard do what it was intended to do. Protect the blade. You will have to decide how you want to store your daggers.

When you clean a blade you should also clean the runners in the scabbard. Most runners are easily removed and replaced if you study how the scabbard is assembled. Use a properly fitting screwdriver as so not to damage the screw heads. Parallel sided gunsmith screwdrivers and not the common tapered carpenter style are the ones to use. Clean and wax the metal runners as you would the blade. It's not the runners but the grit on the runners that does the scratching. Runner tension can also be carefully adjusted to lessen the drag on the blade.

There is no cure for blades 'greying' out. The grey is some surface carbon and other minor impurities in the steel alloy that is turning with age. When the blade was originally forged the surface was dark with fire scale from the forging. When the blade was originally ground and finish polished everything shown bright. Over time the steel acquires a color. Bluish where the alloy is well mixed and ocassionally greying in the areas where the carbon was less amalgamated into the alloy or where some slag was imparted during the forging process. This greying happens from the inside out.

Rust on the other hand is from the outside in due to the exposure of the steel to moisture and or other corrosive agents such as oils and acids from careless handling.

Hope this helps some.

Tony

[Aitor Iriarte]

Slack handle

Hi,
I own a common WH officer dagger. After living all the East Front up to Kurland and then back to the West and a POW camp, the handle became slackened.
The pommel looks solidly attached but the grip and guard move.
If we forget for a moment the sensible 'leave it as it is now', my question is: How is the pommel attached to the tang? Is it possible to disassemble it by gentle handling or is it a big ?
Many thanks in advance!

Aitor

[Ralph P]

For the time being I have pinned this thread to give it as much exposure to the forum members.

Thanks...

[BrianK]

In or out of scabbard

I had just become convinced to store my daggers out of the scabbard when the dust on the blade attracting moisture facts came out, now I am not so sure. I suppose if when removing the blade from the scabbard for the first time you feel resistance or scratching you shold be hesitant about putting it back in.

[emilitaria_usmc]

talking

Even talking over a blade can cause damage. Some people more than others - and who knows who - they just put out a fine spray of moisture when they talk. This can cause damage just like a finger print.

[emilitaria_usmc]

talking

Even talking over a blade can cause damage. Some people more than others - and who knows who - they just unknowingly put out a fine spray of moisture when they talk. This can cause damage just like a finger print.

[Ron Weinand]

Blade Storage

Some things I have learned over 50 years of collecting blades:
1. Rust can't form without moisture. It must be from humidity of at least 50% for rust to form and that, coupled with some type of surface contaminate (dust, lint, fabric that the blade is next to in storage or runners in the scabbard) will hold moisture to the blade, even from room air if the percentage is high enough. Humidity is your enemy, so stop it.
2. Almost all scabbard keepers will damage the blade over time. The less you put the blade in and out, the better. REMEMBER, plated blades will hold up much better, especially in leather scabbards. BUT the keepers will scratch the chrome or nickel plating on a plated blade, so keep this in mind when you insert or remove the blade. MY NUMBER ONE RULE ON PLATED BLADES IS: NEVER OIL A PLATED BLADE. All oils, especially penetrating oil, will seep under the plating through a scratch and will eventually LIFT THE CHROME AND NICKEL PLATING RIGHT OFF THE SURFACE. I have seen too many veteran bring backs where the plated blade has peeled and plating is flaking because of oiling the plated blade on a scratched area (like the tip area) that receives the most in and out wear). I like using a light coat of Simechrome and wiping with a dry terri-cloth towel before storage as the silicon in Simechrome will protect the surface of the blade and seal out room humidity. Remember, I said wiping with a light application of Simechrome, NOT BUFFING OR HARD RUBBING. We are protecting here, not cleaning or polishing.
3. Storing blades in FELT OR on FELT LIKE MATERIAL will hold moisture in contact with the blade and if your room humidity is higher than 50%, rust can set in, so always check these blade at least once a month and wipe them off with a DRY clean terri-cloth towel on a low humidity day. NEVER LEAVE FINGER PRINTS ON THE SURFACE OF THE BLADE, PLATED OR NOT, as the oils in the skin will etch the blade left over time.
4. I store my blades in the bank, where I have checked the humidity over a period of months in the summer and winter to make sure it runs below 50% and store the blade out of the scabbard in silver anti-tarnish cloth (like in your mom's silverware box or drawer) and I HAVE NEVER HAD ANY PROBLEM AND THE SILVER PLATED PIECES WILL NOT TARNISH OVER TIME EITHER. When storing leather hangers and scabbards: be sure not to have the leather in contact with any metal or blade as it will etch the blade from the tannins in the leather. A coat of shoe polish will protect the leather from drying out over time, but you must treat them on a regular (a year or two) basis to prevent drying out. When you have a lot of scabbards that look alike, use string tags and number the dagger or bayonet and the scabbard to prevent mismatches.
5. If you use a dessicant bag type dryer, be sure to replace it often or read the instructions and re-heat it in the microwave to drive out the collected moisture (some bags can be recycled, so read the directions). Remember these bags hold moisture in the area and, when worn out, the moisture held can be released-a big problem.
Ron Weinand
Weinand Militaria

[wiendolch]

Tony, Ron and Craig all have it correct. I'm 100% with you Tony about cleaning the runners, just be careful when turning the screws. Whenever i cleaned a runner on my SA daggers the blade slides in and out smooth as butter. As for the question about storage ( in or out of the scabbard). Just my personal choice to display them out of the scabbard after the blade is protected from the elements and placed in a sealed display case with silica bags. Works wonders at keeping the moisture away from the bare metal and any dust from resting on the blade, 5 years now whithout any spots forming.
One question i ask myself is how did they survive all these years in some cases in untouched mint condition, the first thing that comes to mind is what did the liberator use when returning from the war, my guess is gun oil for metal or gun greese and stored in the scabbard and put in a sock drawer after wiping any fingerprints off. Just the way a soldier would care for a gun.
Just my 2 cents worth!

Eric Wien

[macker89]

Pardon my ignorance gentlemen but with regards to renaissance wax, which parts of a dagger would you use it on? just the handle? the scabbard? the blade? or all of it?

thx,

Bob