Restored uniforms your feelings?

[Nick VR]

Do you think that an original uniform with original insignia that has been 'put together' is still period 'original'.

Personally I don't really like 'put together' uniforms, no matter how good they look. The items don't belong together and thus isn't period but a fantasy piece. It's like having a ferrari but made with some Mercedes and BMW parts to...

[jacquesf]

The problem with SS tunics is that the vast majority stripped the insignia of their tunics before they surrendered. That makes a untouched ss tunic a truely rare item. The same applies to Heer tunics were the national insignia had to be rmoved according to POW regulations. So were do you draw the line when these insignias(original) were reapplied afterwards. It is still a representative piece of history. It is a different story when insignia are added that were not on the tunic originally, like cuff titles and shields. Jacques

[willysproject]

Then accept the fact that you will never ever own a 100% original W-SS uniform in your life... How will you know that it's 100% original untouched and it doesn't have a collar tab that was resewn or restored in the late '50s or early '60s?
Not everyone can obtain an untouched uniform from the family of the veteran, and if you could obtain one, would you turn it down because e.g. the rune-tab has been removed (de-nazified)shortly after the war? (Saying: "Sorry, I don't like it. It's not 100% period original...")

Kind regards,
Gerd V

Do you think that an original uniform with original insignia that has been 'put together' is still period 'original'.

Personally I don't really like 'put together' uniforms, no matter how good they look. The items don't belong together and thus isn't period but a fantasy piece. It's like having a ferrari but made with some Mercedes and BMW parts to...

[willysproject]

IMHO that's the key difference. Completing vs. altering...

It is a different story when insignia are added that were not on the tunic originally, like cuff titles and shields. Jacques

[Anders S]

It's like having a ferrari but made with some Mercedes and BMW parts to...

IMO it is like having a Ferrari which has been served, with changed original parts.

Since I'm restoring an SS-BW marked M43 tunic myself I consider it to be a "put together" tunic, however, it's still an SS-tunic with original period parts.

[phild]

Feelings are fine but at some point we should understand the facts, such as:

In many cases it is IMPOSSIBLE and in many others very subjective to say with assurance that a given item of insignia was period affixed or not. Anyone (IMO) who diagrees with that is not very experienced in uniform study or very honest or both.

There is no shortage of elitest in the field of militaria collecting! Many people tend to measure themselves on what they have and in what condition it is in.....very sad. Every period item has historical merit...I would advise that collectors need to be very carefull what they a pay a premium for in terms of who they buy the item from and what they think the ingegrity of the item is or is being presented as.

[Dennis S]

I voted no ,but with exceptions. In the collectable muscle car industry there are several catagories. Allthough Cars see use and its not a perfect comparison.

Survivor- All Original ,numbers matching low mileage ( Extreme Provedence)

Restored Original Numbers matching- (has original drive train components)ie.Was a stripped real SS style tunic with provedence to start , but later restored with all original insignia

Restored Original Non-numbers- (Its what it supposed to be , but drivetrain components needed to be replaced) ie. Was not a specific SS type tunic but used wartime as such and restored with SS original insignia or some insignia replaced

Clone- Wasn't a musclecar but was rebuilt with proper parts to mimic one
ie. Army tunic never used by the SS but restored with insignia

Fake-. Any of the above varaitions made to deceive.

The idea is to pay accordingly to what your getting. Don't pay untouched price for a restored tunic or original restored price for a clone.

[willysproject]

Please forgive me, but I also would like to comment on the title of the poll beacause I miss the logic in that title and the discussion in this thread .

Do you think that an original uniform with original insignia that has been 'put together'

IMHO this title is formulated in a way everyone should reply YES, no matter what a person's feelings towards restored or completed SS tunics are... An original uniform restored with original insignia IS put together... Period.
So the discussion how one tends to feel towards completed or restored tunics has got nothing to to with the outcome of this poll. A restored tunic remains a restored tunic...

Kind regards,
Gerd V

[ETN]

I voted no as well because of the wording of the question. To me, I have no problem with people restoring uniforms, provided that it can be shown the uniform was SS in the first place. What I mean is, if you find a stripped jacket and you can clearly see that there was army insignia on it, then it should be restored with army insignia. If another stripped uniform shows clear signs of being SS, then it should be restored back to an SS tunic.

As far as I'm concerned, in this day and age, the best you can hope for is an original tunic with original insignia.

[ETN]

Please forgive me, but I also would like to comment on the title of the poll beacause I miss the logic in that title and the discussion in this thread .

Do you think that an original uniform with original insignia that has been 'put together'

IMHO this title is formulated in a way everyone should reply YES, no matter what a person's feelings towards restored or completed SS tunics are... An original uniform with original insignia IS put together... Period.
So the discussion how one tends to feel towards completed or restored tunics has got nothing to to with the outcome of this poll. A restored tunic remains a restored tunic...

Compare the title of this poll with the following comment and you'll see what I mean:
Is a trained monkey that can bring back ball a small ball every time I throw it away still an animal?

Kind regards,
Gerd V

Gerd V,
I totally agree with you. Well said!
~Erich

[Fred S]

I voted yes.
A genuine SS jacket restored with genuines and matching insignias is an SS jacket, maybe not an untouched one of course, but a proper one in my opinion.

[Kurt Meyer]

It's truely insane that all the dealers have orginal applied insigna on there SS jackets... ALL of them! And the prices are...3..4 5 6000 euro?


Just think about the prices of the insigna... and the tunic without insigna..
If you buy all that appart you will save yourselve 50% of it or maybe more?

Why can't the dealers be honest and sell them for the insigna price and a stripped tunic..?

A strange world if you ask me...

Just my 2 cents

Kind Regards,

Michael

[sgstandard]

Restored?

The BEST point brought up so far was that the key is to whether the tunic itself was originally SS, not something that has been converted. This applies to SS M-43 caps as well. That's exactly why I bought the "Dachau" style M-43 cap - VERY standardized, and much less likely to be "restored". NOTHING wrong with reassembled SS tunics. IF YOU WANT SOMETHING BAD ENOUGH - SOMETIMES YOU HAVE TO TAKE WHAT YOU CAN GET!!

[phild]

At least half of the tunics posted on this forum get a mixed review from a host of knowledgeable people as to whether the insignia (all or part) is post 45 re-sewn or not. It is a high bar to stake your life on a given item of insignia being pre-45 attached are not....even more true if you are talking about a custom officer's tunic with item/s of handsewn insignia.

It may be one thing to find some evidence....or imagine the evidence of an item of insgnia that has been re-moved and then one that was replaced over it....like a SS officer's rank tab of sleeve eagle....but it is quite another to say that this was done after 1945...if the thread is correct and the work is convincing.

Few uniforms worn during the war were in fact UNTOUCHED during the war! Soldiers got promoted, transferred and even some uniforms were issued to multiple wearers (sort of uncommon but documented to have been a standard practice when dictated by events) ....

Yes, a restored uniform is worth less that one that has period attached insignia (everything else being equal) but always being able to tell the difference is in many cases impossible.

I will end with this: In every case where I say that an insignia item on any of my uniforms is period original, I can clearly state why I think that item has been on the tunic (or hat) since the war and also why I do not think that it was replaced.

This may sound stupid or simplistic as first read, but think about it and try for yourself. I think that you will learn to be your own judge if you are honest with yourself and observant.

[Nick VR]

Please forgive me, but I also would like to comment on the title of the poll beacause I miss the logic in that title and the discussion in this thread .

The original question was longer, but it seems you can only use a limited number of words. The original question was and stil is:

"Do you think that an original uniform with original insignia that has been 'put together' is still period 'original'."

Nick VR