S.S. Banner discovered in bag of old uniforms!

[sgstandard]

Banner

Here's some more info: 1. Smell test. Does it smell old? Not PROOF of anything, just desirable. 2. Where the stitching on the edges ends, does the stitching go back over itself a little way to reinforce? Good sign. 3. Are there any naturally bonded edges?(similar to an armband). A good sign. 4. GO TO "SEARCH" on this forum. Type in "SS Banner". Then go to about page 3, and look for "SS Banner Questions" posted by Paul R. There is valuable information there on recognizing period stitching and what to look for. It also mentions that wool will bead up into a ball when burnt, but will crush like a used match head if you press on it, unlike synthetic material that melts. Hope this helps.

[N.C. Wyeth]

Here's some more info: 1. Smell test. Does it smell old? Not PROOF of anything, just desirable. 2. Where the stitching on the edges ends, does the stitching go back over itself a little way to reinforce? Good sign. 3. Are there any naturally bonded edges?(similar to an armband). A good sign. 4. GO TO "SEARCH" on this forum. Type in "SS Banner". Then go to about page 3, and look for "SS Banner Questions" posted by Paul R. There is valuable information there on recognizing period stitching and what to look for. It also mentions that wool will bead up into a ball when burnt, but will crush like a used match head if you press on it, unlike synthetic material that melts. Hope this helps.

Nice help!

Brad

[Mike P.]

I tried our good old "Burn Test" and found 2 strands ...

[Mike P.]

When I applied the flame ..it didn't flash like a cotton would , and it didn't burn slow like wool .it burned pretty fast right up to my fingers leaving almost an animal hair or pungent odor and light grey ash...not balled up or hard , very soft.
I could be a Rayon produced using the "Viscose" method--
"The method is able to use wood (cellulose and lignin) as a source of cellulose while the other methods need lignin-free cellulose as starting material. This makes it cheaper and therefore it was used on a larger scale than the other methods.
Contamination of the waste water by carbon disulfide, lignin and the xanthates made this process detrimental to the environment. Rayon was only produced as a filament fiber until the 1930s when it was discovered that broken waste rayon could be used in staple fiber.
The physical properties of rayon were unchanged until the development of high-tenacity rayon in the 1940s."

Remember ..it was thread that was tested , not the body of the flag itself

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rayon#Nitrocellulose

[Mike P.]

Next ..Black light --
I held the sleeve of my Chef Jacket up so you could see what something looks like when it really glows.
These Runes are dead ..no reaction to blacklight

[Vid]

Next ..Black light --
I held the sleeve of my Chef Jacket up so you could see what something looks like when it really glows.
These Runes are dead ..no reaction to blacklight

What about those funky checkerboard chef pants!!!! They are very stylish Should burn those, not the banner.

[Mike P.]

The stitching follows right to each corner and then looks like it doubles back in to secure it tighter.
Also ..here's a better close up of the Material where you can see the 2 tone effect and how the back has no nap at all.
I never saw a repro flag with this type of detail and this quality fabric.

Kris ..since you like these NJ Kitchen pants , I'll send you a pair. What size are you now ..52X25 ?

[Vid]

Found these on Gottlieb's site described as Mega Mint!!! will pass blacklight test

Real chick magnets these are!!

Mike, That banner is fine don't drive yourself nuts over it. Most naysayers have never even seen a real banner or half the items they critique, bookworms with no hands on experience on these items. Its just the way it is. You have handled these items, fold it up nice and neat and put it away and put an end to it. You will never please everyone and why should you have to?.

[Mike P.]

You’re right Kris..and I’ve heard the same from many others tonight.
The thing is ..I was not posting it to get it “blessed” by anyone . I know the story behind it and where it came from so I’m happy. I was only hoping that we could find out more about it though like – what this style was used for , could it be a Vehicle ID banner ? Maybe just for Ceremonies or Funerals ? Maybe Dutch SS?
But once the questions came up , I thought it was important to have them answered ..we have to keep learning and searching for answers.

<OI also thought it would be interesting for other Collectors to see how things still “pop up” when you don’t expect it. But , the way things are in this Hobby today …nobody trusts anything or rarely trusts anything. It was not like that when I started. There was a Code of Honor among Collectors. I think those days might be gone now.</O
The new TR Collectors “Drive By Shooting” trend is really starting to bother me though . They come in the “room” wreak havoc and then leave ..rarely coming back in to clean up the mess. Tonight a friend compared these Collectors to kids that use to make prank phone calls but now get their jollies from starting problems rather than actually contributing to our Hobby.<O</O
This Thread has been up for 2 days and not one member has been able to post another exactly like it ...that speaks volumes by itself.

Our Senior members (and I don’t mean age here) like Howard Kelley,<O</O
John Pic, Bob Hritz, Bob Coleman, Robin Lumsden, Tony ,<O</O
Kris, McInnes , Hanswurst ,Wyeth, Jim M all had positive things to say about it and contributed to this Thread, and that was fantastic. The Detractors however seem to come in , cast doubt on the item …and then when pictures are added ,explanation or addition information provided to them . they rarely respond.
<O</O
It’s a shame we don't have an Ebay style rating system to attach to each members name so we could easily sort out the “Drive By” types ..that would save us a lot of time and aggravation and possibly change the way people post.<O</O
I also want to thank sgstandard for the tip on that other Banner thread ..that’s one of the reasons I posted the extra shots. I thought the added info might help someone-someday. I just hope that "Someone" isn't in the Middle East.
<O></O>
Now that I’ve posted detailed close up shots , I’m wondering if they’ve already been sent to <?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" /><st1:country-region w:st="on"><ST1Pakistan </ST1</st1:country-region>and they are getting ready to start making these now…<O</O
<O</O

[N.C. Wyeth]

Mike,

Keep your chin up, and keep up the good work - it's tough, but it's the only way to keep the spirit alive. Like I've said before, the bona fide collectors here will know how to weed through the ignorant "drive-byer's" snipes . . .

Great flag, and I hope everyone takes the time to soak up a little of what you brought to offer - it was nice for me!

Brad

P.S. Could somebody let me in on where I can find a pair of checkerboard pants like those? I just got an idea about something for the Wife's upcoming Birthday, and they would be perfect!

[PMan]

The Banners

You’re right Kris..and I’ve heard the same from many others tonight.
The thing is ..I was not posting it to get it “blessed” by anyone . I know the story behind it and where it came from so I’m happy. I was only hoping that we could find out more about it though like – what this style was used for , could it be a Vehicle ID banner ? Maybe just for Ceremonies or Funerals ? Maybe Dutch SS?
But once the questions came up , I thought it was important to have them answered ..we have to keep learning and searching for answers.

<OI also thought it would be interesting for other Collectors to see how things still “pop up” when you don’t expect it. But , the way things are in this Hobby today …nobody trusts anything or rarely trusts anything. It was not like that when I started. There was a Code of Honor among Collectors. I think those days might be gone now.</O
The new TR Collectors “Drive By Shooting” trend is really starting to bother me though . They come in the “room” wreak havoc and then leave ..rarely coming back in to clean up the mess. Tonight a friend compared these Collectors to kids that use to make prank phone calls but now get their jollies from starting problems rather than actually contributing to our Hobby.<O</O
This Thread has been up for 2 days and not one member has been able to post another exactly like it ...that speaks volumes by itself.

Our Senior members (and I don’t mean age here) like Howard Kelley,<O</O
John Pic, Bob Hritz, Bob Coleman, Robin Lumsden, Tony ,<O</O
Kris, McInnes , Hanswurst ,Wyeth, Jim M all had positive things to say about it and contributed to this Thread, and that was fantastic. The Detractors however seem to come in , cast doubt on the item …and then when pictures are added ,explanation or addition information provided to them . they rarely respond.
<O</O
It’s a shame we don't have an Ebay style rating system to attach to each members name so we could easily sort out the “Drive By” types ..that would save us a lot of time and aggravation and possibly change the way people post.<O</O
I also want to thank sgstandard for the tip on that other Banner thread ..that’s one of the reasons I posted the extra shots. I thought the added info might help someone-someday. I just hope that "Someone" isn't in the Middle East.
<O></O>
Now that I’ve posted detailed close up shots , I’m wondering if they’ve already been sent to <?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" /><st1:country-region w:st="on"><ST1Pakistan </ST1</st1:country-region>and they are getting ready to start making these now…<O</O
<O</O

Here is a picture of your banners in use during the period. This photo (from what I was told) is from the Police Headquarters building in Koeniggraetz, a city in the Hradec Kralove region of Bohemia. Perhaps someone else may recognize this building as being somewhere else. Please let me know. The bulk of the photos in this grouping relate specifically to the Gestapo and their daily routines while at the office. The photo of the banners was taken in a main conference / meeting room. Hitler's bust sits in the middle of the 2 banners. A pressed cardboard eagle resides above Hitler. The ruinic symbols appear to be identicle in shape as well as the distances from side to side compared to yours. Only the verticle length of the banners seem slightly longer. I also included an image of the headquaters building from the outside. Hope this helps!
Peter

[PMan]

Headquarters

1

[Texasuberalles]

I also included an image of the headquaters building from the outside. Hope this helps!
Peter

If the basement cells of that building coulld only talk...........

[Texasuberalles]

fold it up nice and neat and put it away and put an end to it.

I've always been told something of that value should be rolled and not folded.
You should get a large (at least 3-4 inches in diameter) tube shaped item and loosely roll the banner around it with unbleached muslin keeping the banner from touching itself. What a change from being stuffed down in a plastic bag, eh?

[PMan]

Cells

If the basement cells of that building coulld only talk...........

Do you want to see them?