Heer 85 Inf. Officer tunic

[Luca Ongaro]

3

[Luca Ongaro]

4

[Luca Ongaro]

It appears that the exposed attachment thread attaching the board (s) looks to be the same type/color of thread that is used for the award loops

Hi Glenn, You can clearly see is not as you said by the pictures but if you need on details I can edit news.
Luca

[Paul McKee]

It appears that the exposed attachment thread attaching the board (s) looks to be the same type/color of thread that is used for the award loops, but it could just be the photo.Glenn.

I was more thinking the thread color of the repair or replacement matched the sewing on the buttonhole ribbons. Similar implications, though.

Paul

[Johnny R]

Boards

You do not need to open linings to replace boards and get them to look like the left board that is a myth. The white piped 85th boards still do not make sense on a 1943 tunic to that unit. Now that you pulled the numbers off you can see the 85 were original to the boards leading me to believe even more so than before that they have been added. Confirmation bias is a powerful thing to overcome but if you feel confident this is all originally applied that is the important thing.

[Will Brown]

Interesting read and a nice tunic despite the application of the right SB. The stitching immediately caught my eye too but there is still a lot going for this example IMO. I wonder though, this looks like the tunic of a young front line officer who advanced through the ranks with the typical awards to match, but the IC 2 ribbon and spange? Someone old enough to have served in WWI and thus have received the imperial IC 2 would generally be of a more senior rank. Although I have seen pictures of field grade officers wearing the ribbon/spange, none were what I would call young, and none wore such a profusion of TR grunt awards like on this tunic. Let's face it, war is a young man's business.

And the imperial WB. (Did not pick up on that the first time.)

[Paul McKee]

You do not need to open linings to replace boards and get them to look like the left board that is a myth.

I agree that you don't have to open the lining. A skilled hand using a careful slipstitch can close a shoulder seam with minimal exposed stitches...However, it is the way many folks do it. That's also why I still advise looking at the lining. Sure, if it's intact & unmolested it proves nothing. But if it has been opened, it is sure proof it has been dinked with.

Hmmm...my 1000th post.

Paul

[Luca Ongaro]

Hmmm...my 1000th post.

.... and 1971 was my birth year, have 1000 more and a nice collecting Paul
Luca

[Luca Ongaro]

The white piped 85th boards still do not make sense on a 1943 tunic to that unit.

I do not see signs that make me to think the tunic is restored, could be that the shoulder boards have been reapplied post war but by an in hand inspection I have big doubts about, could be only the cyphers were added but not on these boards, now the question, could be the 85 infanterie division raised in February 1944?
Luca

[Johnny R]

I do not see signs that make me to think the tunic is restored, could be that the shoulder boards have been reapplied post war but by an in hand inspection I have big doubts about, could be only the cyphers were added but not on these boards, now the question, could be the 85 infanterie division raised in February 1944?
Luca

I mean all of the following with respect,

You can believe what ever you would like, it is your tunic. I can't tell you it is not real all I can say is IMO (with others on this thread) the boards are incorrect and IMO have been added post War.

For it to be for the 85th Division he would have been staff with the "85" under a "D". I guess is is possible that he was on Division staff and did not wear a "D" because of the rank pips.

I tend to follow Occam's razor when collecting but I guess the Division thing is "possible" and also of course the loose strap may have been caused by a large cat pulling on it too.

[jacquesf]

If the number 85 was added, it could have been a randomly selected number by the restorer. Maybe there were traces on the shoulder board of a number and the owner decided to put a number back, not necesarilly the same as theoriginal number. I still maintain that boards themselves are original to the tunic and was repaired, the one obviously repaired at some stage. Jacques

[Johnny R]

Post #28

IMO Those numbers have been on there a LONG time-the outline matches the numbers. If we are choosing which fiction is better, IMO the division thing and the damage to the one strap is easier to reify.

[Luca Ongaro]

IMO Those numbers have been on there a LONG time-the outline matches the numbers. If we are choosing which fiction is better, IMO the division thing and the damage to the one strap is easier to reify.

Thanks Jaques, as you I still maintain that boards themselves are original to the tunic and right board was obviously repaired at some stage.
Jhodgson, with all the respect, you can think what you want but please remember is my tunic and you have not on your hands for inspection, I'd like to know why and from what do you condider them added postwar
This is not a fiction, we are talking about an authentic tunic and please I want know more and maybe you too.
You probably don't know that also if 85 was a regiment and not a division (as I think), retired officers when recalled for service wore the the uniform of active officers of their respective units or the uniform of their last unit. This explain as Will Brown pointed why this tunic is awarded with IWW Eisernes Kreuz.

As reference you can see on Uniforms & Traditions of the German Army 1933 - 1945 by John Angolia and Adolf Schlicht.

Luca

[Johnny R]

Tolstoys syndrome

Thanks for pointing out those books, I have never seen them before. It comes down to what you choose to believe. I think there are questions but if you are happy that is great.

Thanks Jaques, as you I still maintain that boards themselves are original to the tunic and right board was obviously repaired at some stage.
Jhodgson, with all the respect, you can think what you want but please remember is my tunic and you have not on your hands for inspection, I'd like to know why and from what do you condider them added postwar
This is not a fiction, we are talking about an authentic tunic and please I want know more and maybe you too.
You probably don't know that also if 85 was a regiment and not a division (as I think), retired officers when recalled for service wore the the uniform of active officers of their respective units or the uniform of their last unit. This explain as Will Brown pointed why this tunic is awarded with IWW Eisernes Kreuz.

As reference you can see on Uniforms & Traditions of the German Army 1933 - 1945 by John Angolia and Adolf Schlicht.

Luca

[Paul McKee]

Thanks for pointing out those books, I have never seen them before.

You dog, you!