SA Signals Unit Sturmfahne

[avis plumb]

Would like to get some options on this one. Everything look OK?

Also, can someone clarify the Jäger designation? I know Jäger loosely translates to "hunter", so would these guys be "Signal Hunters"?

[avis plumb]

other side

[paulj]

Cool flag. Jaeger regiments in the Imperial army were light infantry. Jaeger means hunter in German and traditionally those Jaeger units would have used rifled (and hence more accurate) weapons rather than muskets in the 18th and 19th centuries.

SA units were originally formed as a mirror of local military regiments. SA Jägerstandarte 6 was located in Erfurt (Gruppe Thüringen). Presumably Imperial Jaeger Regiment 6 was stationed there.

Because Jaeger regiments were limited in number, SA Jaeger Standarte are as well.

In this case, it's for a signal sturm of a Jaeger Standarte. That adds to the flag's appeal as well.

[oldflagswanted]

Jaeger meaning & use ???

Cool flag. Jaeger regiments in the Imperial army were light infantry.
Jaeger means hunter in German and traditionally would have used
rifled (and hence more accurate weapons) rather than muskets in
the 18th and 19th centuries.
SA units were originally formed as a mirror of local military regiments.
So this Jaeger Standarte 6 probably was located in the town that had
a Jaeger regiment in the Imperial army.
Because Jaeger regiments were limited in number, SA Jaeger Standarte
are as well.
In this case, it's for a signal sturm of a Jaeger Standarte. That adds to
the flag's appeal as well.

Nice reply, and flag as well. Bravo on both counts.
.

[paulj]

This flag as an additional nice touch: the patch with the signal "Blitz" and "N"
Originally, the SA used the designation "N" for Nachrichten-Sturm and "Pi" for Pionier-Sturm. The Blitz replaced the N and the crossed pick and shovel replaced the Pi. Apparently, this Signal unit used both at one time in the interim.


Here's a Pionier example from collection with both designation forms ... but not on the same patch.

Also, a "N" Sturm corner patch from my photo archive.

[avis plumb]

Thank you for the explanation and the thumbs up Paul, and your thumbs up as well Ben! That seals deal for me, I should have it sometime next week.

[oldflagswanted]

multi corner patch flags ???

This flag as an additional nice touch: the patch with the
signal "Blitz" and "N" Originally, the SA used the designation
"N" for Nachrichten-Sturm and "Pi" for Pionier-Sturm. The Blitz
replaced the N and the crossed pick and shovel replaced the Pi.
Apparently, this Signal unit used both at one time in the interim.
Here's a Pionier example from colelction with both designation
forms ... but not on the same patch.
Also, a "N" Sturm corner patch from my photo archive.

More great info and examples. Just have to love those
multi-corner patch flags. Few seen available years ago, so
decided to instead collect unit flags of all periods and nations.

[paulj]

Just for info Jäger-zu-Pferd-Regiment Nr. 6 was located in Erfurt. It's likely this is the tradition regiment for SA Jaeger Standarte 6.

Interestingly, the top patch is for the signal Sturm of SA Standarte 52 from Prague, Group Sudentenland. Apparently, the Sturm was shifted to the new Standarte after the annexation of Czechoslovakia in October of 1938.

[laurens]

I have my doubts about the first flag. I think the 52 tab is not original to the flag. The distance between Prag and Erfurt is 470 Km, so hard to believe this Sturm moved so far. Further the 52 tab is not piped?

[avis plumb]

Just for info Jäger-zu-Pferd-Regiment Nr. 6 was located in Erfurt. It's likely this is the tradition regiment for SA Jaeger Standarte 6.

Interestingly, the top patch is for the signal Sturm of SA Standarte 52 from Prague, Group Sudentenland. Apparently, the Sturm was shifted to the new Standarte after the annexation of Czechoslovakia in October of 1938.

That's awesome Paul, thank you for the info. Also for posting that great example from your collection.

I have my doubts about the first flag. I think the 52 tab is not original to the flag. The distance between Prag and Erfurt is 470 Km, so hard to believe this Sturm moved so far. Further the 52 tab is not piped?

Neither of the J2/52 patches are piped. It's hard to tell much about the edges of these patches from looking at the seller's pictures, but I'll have a better look at it when it arrives.

[keifer kahn]

Not all were piped.

Especially early ones.

For a quick reference check out the SA flag thread in the political section.
I remember the Friderich Heine flag from Neiderrhein, unpiped canton patch.
There is also several others.(BOB Coleman is the thread starter)

Its also has no fringe,indicitive of early.

[keifer kahn]

Page 482 of Ulrics "Deutschland Erwache" book has the SS-Motorstandarte Standartentuch with a black unpiped canton patch.

Not SA but it is a period item with an unpiped canton patch

My point is that an unpiped canton patch should not be an instant point of suspiscion but that each piece needs to individually analysed.

[avis plumb]

Keifer - great references, thank you! The more I think about it, I believe I remember seeing similar un-piped patches somewhere in "Triumph Des Willens", but can't remeber exactly where in the film.

[keifer kahn]

I own the 257th,s Sturmfahnen which was based in Neuss(Neiderheinn group)and that is early and has no piping on the black canton patch and no fringe.Very similar to the 138th,s sturmfahnen in the reference thread, which also has no piping on the canton patch.

If i am correct about who the seller of your example is, then you cant go wrong.

[Bob Coleman]

Standarte 52 and Jaeger Standarte 6 are both from Gruppe Sudetan. As Laurens previously mentione, 52 was stationed in Prague, Jaeger 6 was stationed in Karlsbad. There were numerous Jaeger Standarte 6 which likely led to the confusion.