Thanks guys.
P08-The finish is about 98%, but finish on these late war pieces is very thin indeed.
I also forgot to point out that there are other parts on this P38 that are phosphate finish, such as: the trigger, slide release, and safety lever.
Leon, I dis-agree with your story on these though. I've heard several stories about these, and usually the story is that these are mis-matched because US GIs put them together as souveneers! I use to believe that too, until I started researching it, and looking at some of the facts.
I've never heard your story before, but it too sounds very far fetched! Let's just look at the fact here:
1. A single US GI (or factory worker), would most likely not be able to completely assemble an entire P38 if the parts were laid in front of them.
2. Many matching pistols observed in the AC45 production are also missing proof marks and firing proofs!
Now let's look at the serial ranges. The MM P38s started appearing in the 33xxc block range. The highest serial number observed is "7468e". Buxtons book states that between 10,000-20,000 MM AC45 P38s were made.
3. Judging by the serial ranges, the MM P38s started being produced at least 60 days before the Americans ever captured the Walther factory! (Buxton confirms this as well)
4. There is no way that a handfull of American GIs (or factory workers), would be able to produce that many P38s in just a few days!
5. There are several photos taken of GIs inside the Walther factory at the time of capture, and there are clearly several cases of P38s that are completed, and the GIs are taking those! Why would they waste time building thier own, or buying them from factory workers?
6. I've never heard any Walther factory worker confirm that story, nor would I believe that any of them would take such a risk in making a P38 to try and trade it!?
Anyways, I agree with Buxton, who states that these MM pistols were assembled between mid February 'til begining of April 1945. Why the MM numbers then? Buxton explains that this was simply because each main assembly line (barrels, slides, and frames), were ordered to produce as many of these items as they could. Therefore each of the main parts were being produced at seperate rates. The result was each ended at a different serial range. The highest know serial number for each component is:
Slide-4232d
Frame-7468e
Barrel-1351d
So you see, that it took much longer to produce a barrel than a slide, and frame production far exceed both barrel, and slide production. (this could also be due to the fact that many FN frames can be found in the AC45 production as well.
Jim stated that these are usually found here in the US. I believe that is because many of these were completed and boxed awaiting shipment at the factory when the Americans captured it. Many GI looted these boxes of course, and that is how most of these MM AC45s found there way here. Just my two cents on that, but it makes much more sense, and photos confirm the P38s, and looting!
Matt
P08-The finish is about 98%, but finish on these late war pieces is very thin indeed.
I also forgot to point out that there are other parts on this P38 that are phosphate finish, such as: the trigger, slide release, and safety lever.
Leon, I dis-agree with your story on these though. I've heard several stories about these, and usually the story is that these are mis-matched because US GIs put them together as souveneers! I use to believe that too, until I started researching it, and looking at some of the facts.
I've never heard your story before, but it too sounds very far fetched! Let's just look at the fact here:
1. A single US GI (or factory worker), would most likely not be able to completely assemble an entire P38 if the parts were laid in front of them.
2. Many matching pistols observed in the AC45 production are also missing proof marks and firing proofs!
Now let's look at the serial ranges. The MM P38s started appearing in the 33xxc block range. The highest serial number observed is "7468e". Buxtons book states that between 10,000-20,000 MM AC45 P38s were made.
3. Judging by the serial ranges, the MM P38s started being produced at least 60 days before the Americans ever captured the Walther factory! (Buxton confirms this as well)
4. There is no way that a handfull of American GIs (or factory workers), would be able to produce that many P38s in just a few days!
5. There are several photos taken of GIs inside the Walther factory at the time of capture, and there are clearly several cases of P38s that are completed, and the GIs are taking those! Why would they waste time building thier own, or buying them from factory workers?
6. I've never heard any Walther factory worker confirm that story, nor would I believe that any of them would take such a risk in making a P38 to try and trade it!?
Anyways, I agree with Buxton, who states that these MM pistols were assembled between mid February 'til begining of April 1945. Why the MM numbers then? Buxton explains that this was simply because each main assembly line (barrels, slides, and frames), were ordered to produce as many of these items as they could. Therefore each of the main parts were being produced at seperate rates. The result was each ended at a different serial range. The highest know serial number for each component is:
Slide-4232d
Frame-7468e
Barrel-1351d
So you see, that it took much longer to produce a barrel than a slide, and frame production far exceed both barrel, and slide production. (this could also be due to the fact that many FN frames can be found in the AC45 production as well.
Jim stated that these are usually found here in the US. I believe that is because many of these were completed and boxed awaiting shipment at the factory when the Americans captured it. Many GI looted these boxes of course, and that is how most of these MM AC45s found there way here. Just my two cents on that, but it makes much more sense, and photos confirm the P38s, and looting!
Matt
Well, next time I´ll check carefully the older posts!
Well done amigo!
Comment