SA Presentation Name

[Ron Weinand]

Can someone fluent in German Script read this name for me and can anyone IE this Strum commander from the Munich (I assume) SA Liebstandarte Unit Strum 9?

[heinrich66]

I believe the name reads "Bregel"

[F. J. Stephens]

SA Presentation Name

Can someone fluent in German Script read this name for me and can anyone IE this Strum commander from the Munich (I assume) SA Liebstandarte Unit Strum 9?

Ron,
I would have very serious doubts about this dagger, and I suggest that you should be very wary about what you see before you. That dedicated inscription is meaningless – a vague reference to “Sturm 9/L” - it doesn’t mean a thing! There were lots of “Sturm 9s”; What is the Standarte? Where does this small unit fit in the overall scheme of the SA hierarchy? Sorry, but this one is a non-starter from the very beginning.
And what about that signature – “Breber”? It really doesn’t matter if he can be found and be proved to have existed. The signature is questionable in many respects. For example, the vertical lines of the signature vary from thin to the grossly thick. Any etcher or engraver worthy of his craft can replicate a signature to an almost perfect facsimile – but that doesn’t look like a signature at all. It looks like a “drawing” or “cartoon” of a supposed signature, but not a “signature” that can be performed by any pen that I can imagine.
With normal penmanship all vertical strokes will have the same thickness as any other; and all angular strokes will likewise have the same identical width and features.
I am sorry, Ron, but I have to say that the inscription on your blade has, in my view, glaring errors. In my view it is a bad piece. So what is your account for the piece? Where did it come from?
Frederick

[F. J. Stephens]

Photo problem

Can somebody please assist me in gettting a photo uploaded - it is actually quite important and pertinent to the above thread.

FJS

[ivbaust]

I would read the name as "Biegel". The reason for this is the little dot above the letter behind the B. Thus I would say it´s a "i" instead of a "r".

What do you think about the font of "In treuer Kameradschaft Sturm 9/L"? Doesn´t it look like a modern font? I would appreciate more opinions about that.

[ivbaust]

Can somebody please assist me in gettting a photo uploaded - it is actually quite important and pertinent to the above thread.

FJS

PM sent

[Rheingold]

I would read the name as "Biegel". The reason for this is the little dot above the letter behind the B. Thus I would say it´s a "i" instead of a "r".

What do you think about the font of "In treuer Kameradschaft Sturm 9/L"? Doesn´t it look like a modern font? I would appreciate more opinions about that.

i would read:Briegel

[Ron Weinand]

Fred, you have finally crossed the line with me with your negativity. I KNOW for a fact that period pieces (I even got one from a veteran) have long been associated with the SA Liebstandarte from Munich in the manner in which they have inscribed this unit's daggers.
Long ago one is in Tom Johnson's series of dagger books with a crossguard inscribed Treue um Treue Strum 2/L. Both the motto is known to be Bavarian and the L Standarte is from Munich. So this type of marking of SA Daggers for this unit from the Munich area is know to be correct.
As to the signature, until we can be sure who the SA mann or officer is and can determine HOW he signed his name, I wouldn't be so quick to condem his style of signature.
I am NOT going to join another Craig Gotcha thread again. The last one was fruitless and I won't waste my time again.
Its time to get this hobby out of the glass is always half empty world and move on. Until such time as someone can provide information on the man's signature and his service, I am content with investiagtion, not critization.

[The Red Baron]

Why such animosity?????

1. Just because there are other period examples of this style engraving doesnt that simply allow the possibility for legitimacy as opposed to proving it
2. Why not just defend the piece with other examples and where it came from, etc?

[Ron Weinand]

Because every time someone posts a presentation piece, Fred is on the bad side it seems to me. I don't mind questioning the fonts or the style, but the content when other known examples with the same style abbreviation exist, please?

[tanker]

Are you above criticism?

[The Red Baron]

WHile I don't claim to know such dedications, I can understand questioning this piece for some reasons like the Thick/Think issue with the name. I was just wondering why you don't show us some other ones you might have or have pictures of?

I feel like any type of dedication like this is always going to be somewhat questioned?

[James P]

Fred never likes anything he has not found himself.

[Ron Weinand]

I am not questioning his stand on fonts or engravings, but his take on the Strum 9/L usage. This type of abbreviation is known to be from the period and other examples exist that are known originals. See Tom Johnson's book series for a similar use of the SA term.

[F. J. Stephens]

Is it real, or is it not?

Fred, you have finally crossed the line with me with your negativity. I KNOW for a fact that period pieces (I even got one from a veteran) have long been associated with the SA Liebstandarte from Munich in the manner in which they have inscribed this unit's daggers.
Long ago one is in Tom Johnson's series of dagger books with a crossguard inscribed Treue um Treue Strum 2/L. Both the motto is known to be Bavarian and the L Standarte is from Munich. So this type of marking of SA Daggers for this unit from the Munich area is know to be correct.
As to the signature, until we can be sure who the SA mann or officer is and can determine HOW he signed his name, I wouldn't be so quick to condem his style of signature.
I am NOT going to join another Craig Gotcha thread again. The last one was fruitless and I won't waste my time again.
Its time to get this hobby out of the glass is always half empty world and move on. Until such time as someone can provide information on the man's signature and his service, I am content with investiagtion, not critization.

What is your problem Ron? Do you want a real answer, or do you not want a real answer at all - just something that assuages your sense of self-importance?

I cannort upload the photo that I wanted to send to you - so I am relying uopn the assistance of a well-meaning friend.

FJS