Collecting 'Goals' ?

[Skipper Greenwade]

Just curious,

What motivates you to collect militaria in general and Third Reich daggers in particular? Do you collect purely as a hobby; does the investment potential enter into the picture at all; do you collect all types of daggers or specialize in one or two types? Are daggers/blades your main area of interest or do you collect to augment a collection of decorations, uniforms, etc?

Years ago, getting representative examples of each of the various daggers was a goal for a number of collectors. There were also the ones who collected by type, maker mark (especially popular with SA daggers), etc.

Nowadays, given the scarcity of good material, the ever -increasing prices, and the problem of reproductions, sometimes I wonder why anyone would want to get into the hobby. Don't get me wrong - I'm pleased the hobby is growing and welcome every new collector who comes along, but what I started off doing as a hobby now seems like it could be very intimidating to the uninitiated or the novice. I know a number of people I work and otherwise come in contact with have a keen interest in the 'stuff' until they begin to realize how much time, effort and money it takes to be a serious collector.

Thought this thread would be a good 'discussion starter' and might help me get a handle on just why the hobby continues to grow. Other trains of thought might include; How long have you been collecting militaria? What other interests do you pursue, if any?

Just really wanted to throw the door open and kind of take everyone's pulse. Thanks in advance for letting us hear (read, actually) what you have to say!

Best,
Skip

[Billy G]

Hi Skipper,
Excellent topic and one I've often pondered myself. I have to say that there are many schools of thought. I think when I started 3 years ago I probably intended to get as representative a collection of Third Reich pieces as I could. That's probably not feasible for most people, myself included. It's been an interesting transformation since then.

I think first off I got some of the more common pieces. But I tried to get them in as good a shape as I could find, appealing to my sense of perfection. I also tried to get items that were from rare makers, which appealed to my love of anything rare. I gradually started getting a nice, small collection. But eventually if one collects Third Reich daggers one gets to the stage where the prices jump drastically. It's inevitible but it is a shock to the system. This turns out to be a hobby that costs as much as many if not much more. I don't think investment potential drives me, but when you pay a few thousand dollars for a unit you have to consider the potential. I always try to stick to textbook pieces for just this reason. I suppose Third Reich pieces will always have the upper hand as more desireable but I've started to deviate from them somewhat toward Imperial or Weimar pieces. I know there's not the demand for them, but their quality is usually superlative and they have so much more history behind them. And a sweet Imperial piece will always have a market, thankfully. I also like the fact that there seems to be less incidence of fakery, although I do know it exists.

Some collectors are type collectors, seeking to stick with one type and acquiring every variation of that type. I have never been lcky enough to find a type that Iliked that much so as to foresake the others. I'm not monogomous with daggers. I usually get a nice example and file it away and move on to another love affair. I have been lucky in that there are a few I'm not partial to so it's easy to stay away. RLBs don't do it for me. Neither do S/As, but I can always love a mint piece or rare maker.

One problem is I'm fickle. I like one thing one week and then concentrate on another next week. One week it was SSs. I got a Boker and seem to have moved on. Then it was Polizei bayonets and feuerwehr daggers. Who knows, maybe next week it'll be hirschfängers. There really are too many beautiful pieces out there to tickle the fancy.

Another problem is the availability of good stuff, or the lack thereof. Eban was never great but I suppose it's worse than ever now. Thier arbitrary policies have no basis in reality and it's clear they are more concerned with placating the panty waists of the world rather than monitoring themselves. Eban certainly doesn't give a damn about authenticity. All that serves is to burn newbies to the hobby. I've come to the conclusion that for me to get some more pieces I will probably have to start trying to buy from vets directly. There's so many pieces that are such high ticket items it's ridiculous. Who's got that kind of money nowadays?

I couldn't say how I got interested in daggers, or militaria in general. I suppose I've always had an interest in German military history, even as a kid. Prior to getting a computer I had a Luft helmet and a KVKII. That's it. Maybe the computer was more of a curse than a blessing?!? Certainly my disposible income has disappeared.

Presently I do what I would advise any new collector to do, I buy what I like. I really like unusual pieces, whatever they may be, an unusual hirschfänger or super rare maker mark. But it's all subjective. Presently I seem to be driven too by Polizei bayonets. But that may change. Next week I'll probably be back to lusting after rare maker SSs.

Isn't it a grand addiction we all suffer from?

[Sebastian Bianchi]

I find it hard to believe more of you guys don't have an opinion!

Seba

[CRAIGGOODWIN]

My thoughts

I to have always loved the German stuff, When I started I didnt even know where to start, so I had heard eBay had stuff & I logged etc & started placing bids on anything that moved
Luckily someone warned me about a polish gentlemen directed me here etc & the rest is history.
I have seen heaps of posts about guys that stick to one category ie medals, then others will say daggers, uniforms, belt buckles etc just look at all the different forums here. For me I want a bit of everything but my one channel is Army, I have restricted myself to only army but have medals, daggers, did have a helmet b4 i sent it back, have a soldbuch coming though & have stumbled across an artillery uniform for I think is a song ( only luck I have ever had ) but again all army. I to started off with the common items, I have 1 each of the common badges like the IAB, Pab etc. I have a fantastic mint K98 with Bakelite grips like it was made yesterday, I have the same in a dress dagger again like it was made yesterday both from Sterling Gambino, A fairly mint Kober SA etc. At the moment this is all I have in the dagger field. I want an SS but the money is a bit pricey. I also want a early HJ with the motto, & maybe a police bayo. Perhaps an Army dagger but they dont do a lot for me. Then I will move onto an Army sword & I think this will do me for the daggers. In the mean time I also need an Army Flak badge etc so it really never stops.
I have a good mate who collects everything from cufftitles, badges, daggers, medals etc but unlike me he likes everything Army, luft , Kreigs etc. I shake my head cause he is all over the place but at the same time I admire him cause he is above me in what he has. If I was like him I would be living in a shack on the side of the road but at least I'd have a good collection.
Over here is it a bit hard as our troops only met the Germans in North Africa, Greece & crete before being pulled back to fight the Japs. So we dont have a 100th of what you guys have over here. If you went to one of our shows you'd be doubled up laughing so hard you'd need a box of tissues to dry your eyes from crying so much with laughter.
Also our exchange is ****house so anything we buy is double, I'm amazed I get to buy anything at all. I think I started at a bad time as the vets are slowly but surely dropping off. In another 10 years will there be any left ???
Skip I hope this is what you are after & i hope this turns out to be a good thread
Regards

[Jody]

My Collecting Goals

Hello,
This is my 29th year of collecting, and I guess I still have not picked a favorite area. I collect all sorts of things-medals, badges, medal bars, daggers, helmets, belt buckles, glassware, etc.

I have been into Imperial items since the mid-80's, but I still get excited when I see a nice 3rd Reich era helmet, buckle, or badge.

Currently I collect what will make the nicest looking displays. I am also having these items beautifully frammed so my son will have some nice militaria items in the future.

My collecting goals are simple, I collect what I like, and if I get tired of it, I sell it and buy something else (although there are some things I will not part with). I bet I have sold five collections worth of stuff this way. In my opinion, it keeps my collection fresh and gives me something different to look at.
Regards,
Jody

[Skipper Greenwade]

First,

A "thank-you" to Seba for re-starting this thread.

It looks like most of the collectors responding are doing what I think everyone should do with their hobbies - enjoying them and collecting what they like. As I said earlier, I am first & foremost a dagger collector, but there is so much other neat 'stuff' out there that it's hard to limit oneself. I rationalize a lot my pruchases in the other fields (decorations, insignia, etc.) because they are good to group with the daggers and really serve to round out the collection. Others are just things I wanted because they are of keen historical interest and/or have a lot of eye appeal. I have one Imperial spiked helmet and several other pieces of headgear, a Luftwaffe honor goblet, an SS honor ring and a number of other items that aren't really blade-related, so I don't think any of us with the heart of a true collector can limit themselves to just daggers or medals or uniforms or ?????

I have been fortunate in that I have seen the value of my collection rise dramatically over the years, but investment potential doesn't drive my collecting interests. I've learned that you should buy what you like in the best condition you can afford, maintain your "treasures" and share your collection and knowledge. If that means you buy an Army dagger at one show and an NSKK crash helmet at the next, you aren't breaking any "rules".

The one argument I will make in favor of developing a primary interest is that you will tend to develop more knowledge in your chosen field and are less likely to purchase something you won't be happy with later. However, with the wealth of reference material available now, the advent of forums like this and other means by which information sharing is made easier, that risk has been reduced somewhat.

Okay, it's someone else's turn

Best to all,
Skip

[Ralph A]

I began collecting Nazi daggers myself a just few months back, and have 2 now, an SA dagger and a HJ "fahrtenmesser". I have a nice Army dagger on the way from Helmut Weitze, pics of which I will post when it arrives. It's a sweetie, and I looked long and hard all over before settling on this particular blade, the same way I did when looking for the SA piece. The HJ job is fairly standard, with no motto, but nevertheless a nice knife.

Next: Luftwaffe officer's dagger (haven't decided which), then I'll save my $$ for an SS piece. Expensive, though, and I'm torn between this, and a DK in silver. Maybe both!

I consider these particular daggers to be good representative, basic examples of "Nazi steel" and they really make nice additions to my collection of awards, medals, badges, documents, personal effects, tinnies, day badges, feldpost, stamps, cloth items & etc. In other words, for the "non-specialist', the "basic" pieces do fine without getting into the more esoteric pieces as mentioned above.

I MUST SAY HOWEVER:
Once you handle one of these daggers, you immediately see the attraction. The design of the things is fantastic, and the sturdy workmanship of a surpassing quality. They are serious collectibles. You have to hold and handle them to appreciate them fully, then they begin to work their mystique on you!

Now that I have 2 with 1 on the way, I don't think I'll stop. I'm hooked (or "stuck", if you pardon the pun!)

[Skipper Greenwade]

Ralph,

I know exactly what you mean. At least for me, the daggers give one more of a sense of history than any other collectible. Anyone who has watched over three minutes of any of the PBS or History Channel features on the Third Reich has seen the rallies complete with hundreds if not thousands of SA and SS men, each of which is wearing a dagger. Consequently, they can relate to the historical significance much easier than they can the decorations - which generally require at least rudimentary knowledge to really make an impression. (Probably the only thing that might be more recognizable would be a German helmet).

I'm not 'dogging' the medal and badge collectors, as I have a number of both, but my appreciation for them only developed after I had spent considerable time in the hobby and learned the difference between a Knght's Cross and an Iron Cross 2nd Class. I have learned to appreciate the workmanship in, for example, a DK, but I guess I'll always show off my daggers first!

Best,
Skip

[kmh]

Hallo there

Why collecting ??

As comming from Denmark I maybe was forced into collecting because the Germans left almost all equipment behind and walk back home after May the 5th. 45.
So as a kid in the early 60'ties a lot of the "left behind's" was around as toy's, I think I could supply a platoon with all kind of equipment.

Well those was the day's, everything is lost during the progress in life, schools, education and moving from home. ect.
But I keep my collecting spirit and started all over again, mostly in equipment and bayonets.

But I had the big big luck so to say, getting close to the real stuff, Had play with it, smell to it, dismantle it, get into it in almost all details. I remember the mix of smells from leather and hairgrease ? In my helmet's.

I feel a kind of sorry for the many collectors who not had have this chance today, it's naturally not a possibility when first born later and in another place in the world.

It lead me say something about the subjects collecting Daggers.
I really love to look at the daggers all kind, study the details and reading regarding the story about them. Get interessted in the debat concerning minor and major topics around them.

But Eban and horror prices, fraud and reproductions had directed or forced me into another way of collecting.

Just think about how much time all members spending discussion reproductions in order to prevend getting burn.

I feel very sorry everytime I read a topic, regarding a new way of faking.
How someone produced (things) in order to steal somebody fellow collectors money, and giving the hobby another new bad taste.

But thats why I think a place like this the Forum are a place of a great importance, where collectors who not have a age, place of birth ect. as I was fortunate to get, in order to collect German stuff.

Best regard

Kim in Copenhagen

[Frank Mills]

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