Original Panzer EM M43?

[RobertE]

The sewing is correct for these type hats -

[RobertE]

And the markings are correct. So - I'm curious. What is it that makes this hat unacceptable? The fact it didn't come from a collector, or a big name dealer? For example:

"I have one of those cap eagles, which I bought from _____ militaria. It's a known fake."
"The inside liner seams were not finished in this manner. They should look like this ____ (attachment)."
"The wool is the wrong type. It should be lighter wool, IMO, like an NSKK sidecap."
"The stamp is totally incorrect for this maker - whoever concieved this bad replica should be shot. It looks like my kid made it with a potato. A real one should look like this _____ (insert thread)."

You get my point, hopefully. No offense intended, but telling me you'd pass when I have no idea what your base of knowledge is doesn't do much for me, or any collector that is trying to make a call on an item. Telling me WHY is is not a good piece - or you don't believe it to be a good piece - is instructive, on the other hand.

s/f Robert

[Sammler]

I like this hat more then I dont.

Question for me would be at this stage it seems an RB number would be used for an ISSUE hat and also standard pebbled buttons.

These are very rare hats and some more questions to the "house cleaner" may be interesting to know background wise but the end of the day its still what it is or isnt.

[BenVK]

I have a Lago M43 cap. The stamp is similar but not identical. Hope this helps a bit. I quite like this Pz cap but would have to handle it to be sure.

[RobertE]

Sammler, thanks for the comments. I have M43s both with and without RBN numbers, and you bring up an excellent point - I don't know the answer as to which of the two marking methods is more correct.

Ben, that's a great posting, and a good comparative example. Can you read the date on yours? s/f Robert

[Luca Ongaro]

Hello Robert, I'd be confortable with this cap for my collection if you want sell it, original IMO.
Luca

[Luca Ongaro]

I like this hat more then I dont.

Question for me would be at this stage it seems an RB number would be used for an ISSUE hat and also standard pebbled buttons.

That's right but not with original Lago stamp Sammler.
Ben thanks to show that stamp.
Luca

[besslein]

Hello Robert, I'd be confortable with this cap for my collection if you want sell it, original IMO.
Luca

Im with you Luca,this cap look very very good to me

[NickG]

I like it also...VERY MUCH actually. I would take a chance on it in a heart beat!!
(for the right price)

[BenVK]

Date in mine is 1944.

[Rene Chavez]

And the markings are correct. So - I'm curious. What is it that makes this hat unacceptable? The fact it didn't come from a collector, or a big name dealer? For example:

"I have one of those cap eagles, which I bought from _____ militaria. It's a known fake."
"The inside liner seams were not finished in this manner. They should look like this ____ (attachment)."
"The wool is the wrong type. It should be lighter wool, IMO, like an NSKK sidecap."
"The stamp is totally incorrect for this maker - whoever concieved this bad replica should be shot. It looks like my kid made it with a potato. A real one should look like this _____ (insert thread)."

You get my point, hopefully. No offense intended, but telling me you'd pass when I have no idea what your base of knowledge is doesn't do much for me, or any collector that is trying to make a call on an item. Telling me WHY is is not a good piece - or you don't believe it to be a good piece - is instructive, on the other hand.

s/f Robert

My thoughts exactly I prefer better comments then is just bad and for what is worth I like the construction and the trap on this field cap a lot more then the officer panzer cap I had posted a while back!

Rene Chavez
Http://axis101.bizland.com

[Raven26]

...

[RobertE]

"Please take it for what it is worth; When people like Mr. Singer, Mr. Davis, Mr. McInnes, Mr. Stezelberger and a few others indicate they suspect a fake, the item is most likely just that...an illusion. They have no hidden agenda other than to protect you and the hobby."

Assuming the motivation and intent behind a comment in a forum discussion group - like "protection" of an unknown collector - seems like a stretch to me. They are simply contributing to a discussion. Their opinions - and the opinions of junior collectors - are of value in these discussions, but the collector has the responsibility to make the final call.

If you are waiting for concensus from all hands for every item, particularly those that are not often seen, you'll likely wait a lifetime to acquire that item. I am in the same position as others in that I have posted things I know to be real, and had them dismissed. Some of us started collecting when the vets still had full heads of hair, remember.

One of the esteemed members of your group listed above bought it, so consensus even among giants is not required. I'll bet my jeep it won't come back to me after the inspection period I offered. I understand the points you make, but disagree.

regards, Robert

[Raven26]

Assuming the motivation and intent behind a comment in a forum discussion group - like "protection" of an unknown collector - seems like a stretch to me. They are simply contributing to a discussion. Their opinions - and the opinions of junior collectors - are of value in these discussions, but the collector has the responsibility to make the final call.

If you are waiting for concensus from all hands for every item, particularly those that are not often seen, you'll likely wait a lifetime to acquire that item. I am in the same position as others in that I have posted things I know to be real, and had them dismissed. Some of us started collecting when the vets still had full heads of hair, remember.

One of the esteemed members of your group listed above bought it, so consensus even among giants is not required. I'll bet my jeep it won't come back to me after the inspection period I offered. I understand the points you make, but disagree.

regards, Robert

Hello Robert,

Either you read too much into my comment or I did a poor job of communicating my thoughts. I will attempt to make myself more clear. Let me first state that we are both on the same sheet of music. No ill intent on my part.

First, I did not mean to speak for the names listed. It was my intent to say I value their opinions. Are they capable of making error or even have varying opinions among themselves? Absolutely.

Secondly, I do not wait for opinions only. I do, however, value their wise counsel. They have saved me much frustration. I make every attempt to self-educate too. I make every effort to ensure my items have collecting value in terms of historical relevance and monetary protection (my invested money).

Lastly, my first comment was to illustrate the fact this is a dangerous hobby. It is my assumption you posted this cap for verification on authenticity. Not that you did, but we often see collectors post an item and look for the answers they want. When they do not receive the answers they were hoping for, they become argumentative. I believe that is why some individuals refrain from such dialog and only offers their opinion as to a basic "yes and no" type response.

As for this particular cap. It has many many nice qualities. So much so, that it does need a hands-on inspection. It is my sincere hope this is a good one.

Best Regards,

Frank

[B. N. Singer]

"Please take it for what it is worth; When people like Mr. Singer, Mr. Davis, Mr. McInnes, Mr. Stezelberger and a few others indicate they suspect a fake, the item is most likely just that...an illusion. They have no hidden agenda other than to protect you and the hobby."

One of the esteemed members of your group listed above bought it....

regards, Robert

Interesting.

B. N. Singer