Salamander Schuhfabrik....

[Hundestaffel]

Interesting and little known:

Salamander gehörte während der Zeit des Nationalsozialismus zu den deutschen Schuhunternehmen, die ihre Schuhe von KZ-Häftlingen im Konzentrationslager Sachsenhausen testen ließen. Dabei mussten die Häftlinge im sogenannten Schuhläufer-Kommando eine mit unterschiedlichen Belägen ausgestattete 700 Meter lange Teststrecke mehrmals bis zu 40 Kilometer zurücklegen.

Vera Friedländer: „Mag sich in unserer Zeit, Jahrzehnte danach, Salamander-Schuhe kaufen, wer will. Ich jedenfalls, das ist sicher, werde keine Schuhe mit diesem Namen tragen. Ich muss, wenn ich diesen Namen höre, an die Schuhe ohne Besitzer denken. Es stimmt nicht, dass die Zeit alle Wunden heilt.“ Vera Friedländer arbeitete als Zwangsarbeiterin im Reparaturbetrieb der Salamander AG „zusammen mit 50 bis 60 Leuten“, polnischen Schuhmachern, Franzosen, Serbinnen und jüdischen Frauen – bis am 18. März 1945 eine Bombe das Gebäude teilweise zerstörte. Das Berliner Adressbuch aus dem Jahr 1937 weist die Salamander AG als Betreiberin eines Reparaturbetriebes in der Köpenicker Straße 6a nach. In Vera Friedländers Arbeitsbuch ist die Adresse auf dem Salamander-Stempel deutlich zu erkennen.

[Weweslburg]

The statement by Mrs. Friedländer is ridiculous and dumb. If all Germans would have the same opinion, the German economy would break down, because almost each German company employed slave workers back then.....AEG, BMW, Audi, Volkswagen, Siemens, Blaupunkt, Oetker etc. etc.

I am sure that Mrs. Friedländer has certainly bought a product from one of these thousands of companies.

Such statements are an affront against each German and especially against our generation who has absolutely nothing to do with the Holocaust. People abroad always think that we Germans do still regret, but we don´t. The Holocaust is history and none of our family members, fathers, grandfathers and uncles had anything to do with Jews or is responsible for crimes against Jews. Most Germans are bored and tired as far as the never ending Holocaust stories are concerned. Our generation and even the generation before is not guilty and it is time to close this damned Holocaust book.....and it is time to end these billions and billions payments to Holocaust survivers. It is enough !

[Hundestaffel]

Weweslburg;

Glad you enjoyed this thread.


"Hundeschuhstaffel"

[Weweslburg]

I just didn´t enjoy the dumb statement by Mrs. Friedländer and the eternal and never ending lamentations. Vera Friedländer is just a capitalist who wrote several books about the Holocaust and her own experiences, although she was just 15 years old back then. She moans and moans just because she was kept by the Gestapo for several hours and forced to work for Salamander for 3 months.....Oh my God, what a hard fate while 100.000´s of German women and girls had been killed while allied terror attacks or raped by Russian soldiers.

It is a fact that Mrs. Friedländer "voluntary" worked as typist for a German armament company. Just in the "beginning" of 1945 she worked 3 months for Salamander. These 3 months made her very rich by selling millions of books.

Weweslburg;

Glad you enjoyed this thread.


"Hundeschuhstaffel"

[codytrcollector]

The statement by Mrs. Friedländer is ridiculous and dumb. If all Germans would have the same opinion, the German economy would break down, because almost each German company employed slave workers back then.....AEG, BMW, Audi, Volkswagen, Siemens, Blaupunkt, Oetker etc. etc.

I am sure that Mrs. Friedländer has certainly bought a product from one of these thousands of companies.

Such statements are an affront against each German and especially against our generation who has absolutely nothing to do with the Holocaust. People abroad always think that we Germans do still regret, but we don´t. The Holocaust is history and none of our family members, fathers, grandfathers and uncles had anything to do with Jews or is responsible for crimes against Jews. Most Germans are bored and tired as far as the never ending Holocaust stories are concerned. Our generation and even the generation before is not guilty and it is time to close this damned Holocaust book.....and it is time to end these billions and billions payments to Holocaust survivers. It is enough !

Not sure where you got your facts from, but plenty of German citizens today have Fathers and Grandfathers that were responsible for the atrocities committed during the Holocaust. Furthermore, closing the "damn book", as you so eloquently put, will only subject the future generations to the possibility of repeating that horrific chapter in our history, hints why we learn from the past and continue to teach it.
I very well could be interrupting your comment inaccurately, but its nature appears somewhat anti-Semitic, and if so, it has absolutely no place here. And to those who are, all I can say is you're more than welcome to take yourself and "superior" family and live as the prisoners did in the camps during those horrible times. I'd would love to hear your thoughts after acouple years of doing so.....might sound like, "[this] is enough!"....that's if you're still alive.

[Weweslburg]

"Plenty" of German citizens have fathers and Grandfathers that were responsible for the atrocities committed during the Holocaust ???? I tell you what: Most, so Millions of Germans, so also my uncles and grandfathers as well as my father in law have fought at several frontlines and none of these was involved in the Holocaust. My father in law who died last year was "called" to the Wehrmacht age 17 and he fought heavy defense battles in Russia, Ukraine and Hungaria. This man has even not seen a single Jew anywhere in these areas. Do you or all the others really believe that an ordinary German soldier knew about Auschwitz or other concentration camps ? They fought for its life and survival, against hunger and frostbites. To claim that a plenty of Germans have relatives who were "responsible" for the Holocaust is a heavy and hurting offense against 80 million Germans of our generation. I can hold my head high and say that none of my relatives had committed any crimes against Jews, because I exactly know all military careers of each of my ancestors.

I want to point out that I am neither anti semitic nor a racist ! To claim this is more than cheeky. YOU foreigners still offend us Germans and still call our generation Nazis. NO Italian citizen still moans because of Mussolini, no American still moans because of all the committed war crimes against Indians, Germans, Koreans, Vietnamese, Afghans etc, no Russian moans because of Stalin, no Spain because of Franceo, no Chinese because of Mao..... but WE Germans are still the beasts and - of course - anti semitists in the moment we state that the Holocaust book shall finally be closed. Brigadier General Paul Tibbets is still an American hero, because he was responsible to exterminate 100.000 civilians, a German soldier is a criminal, because he was a German soldier and automatically involved in war crimes and the Holocaust....typical double standard ! I am sick and bored that foreigners judge and offend our aged German people and still our generation. No German would ever judge an aged US, British or Russian Veteran, because it is a matter of respect and character. Althoug we Germans know about the allied terror attacks on all German cities and villages, none of us would ever offen an old foreign Veteran. I have so many friends in the states and none of them has ever offended a German. And by the way: one of my very best US friends is a US book writer.... and he is Jewish !

One last note: I was four times in England and was four times verbally insulted by British people. My beloved Mother was spit at by a british teenager and called a Nazi bitch, just because we were Germans. When I was a 19 year old teenager, I was outside France along with friends. We even didn´t get fuell for our car, because we were Germans. Such incidents still happens, because people are dumb and still see our peaceful German generation as Nazis. Sad but true ! YOUR comment show that you are also such a person if you assume that I am anti semitic. UNBELIEVABLE !

Not sure where you got your facts from, but plenty of German citizens today have Fathers and Grandfathers that were responsible for the atrocities committed during the Holocaust. Furthermore, closing the "damn book", as you so eloquently put, will only subject the future generations to the possibility of repeating that horrific chapter in our history, hints why we learn from the past and continue to teach it.
I very well could be interrupting your comment inaccurately, but its nature appears somewhat anti-Semitic, and if so, it has absolutely no place here. And to those who are, all I can say is you're more than welcome to take yourself and "superior" family and live as the prisoners did in the camps during those horrible times. I'd would love to hear your thoughts after acouple years of doing so.....might sound like, "[this] is enough!"....that's if you're still alive.

[JUNGCO]

I don't believe this forum is the place for this argument. History is history.
Jeff

[chrischa]

I agree, the argument is probably worth toning down a bit.

But, weweslburg is right. Germany is still unfairly thought of as the enemy by plenty of people.
Those of us here no doubt see it differently but working in a large headcount environment it is still true. The media and entertainment certainly do it but tongue in cheek.

Weweslburg I don't think your anti semetic just boiling with frustration shared in your second language.

[FreeRange]

I am still at a loss as to what is currently 'okay' to discuss and what is still taboo.

I have always been at a loss to fully understand why one person's personal tragedy 'counts' and another person's personal tragedy does not.

I learned little to nothing of WW2 in school...perhaps because it was too soon? After all, Hogan's Heroes was playing on TV at the time I was a child...and it was perfectly fine to poke fun at Germans (even my Dad loved Hogan's Heroe's ).

My kids (recently graduated from high school) learned a bit more about WW2 in general...but not much more than I did.

I am waiting to see if and when the schools implement a comprehensive WW1 and WW2 history program. It wouldn't be hard to implement and I think it would be a great benefit. It's hard to learn from the past if we don't know the past...

[Larry Davis]

The original poster should know better than include a quote like that, you've been here long enough. It's perfectly obvious to anyone with eyes as to which way the thread is going to go because of it. The blame lies with the OP. Think before you post.

[codytrcollector]

It's common knowledge, even for the adult layman, that most German citizens during the epoch of the Reich weren't involved in the camps or the field killings of the so called "undesirables". I honestly don't know anyone-regardless of what country they're from-who thinks Germans having connections in their ancestry that are directly affiliated to the actions committed during the holocaust is the norm rather than the exception. Nonetheless, you made a transparent statement conveying that currently absolutely not one person in Germany has relatives who were involved with the Holocaust or turned a blind eye to it. Such a statment is quite false, and though the majority of individuals during the era were nothing other than honest, hard-working patriotic members of society, the Wehrmacht and other organizations, there are still plenty of exceptions to that rule, such as Heinrich Himmler's daughter, Gudrun Himmler.
I'm sorry you feel that all "us" foreigners offend Germans and "call them all Nazis" but not once in my life have I done that, publicly nor in the domain of my residents, granted I don't see the problem in calling a portion of the people who lived in Third Reich Germany Nazis considering that's exactly what many were during the period. It's no different, in my opinion, than calling a modern day American a Republican or Democrat. And is there any difference between your generalization of foreigners than all us foreigners supposed preconceived ideas of you all? Is that too not a double standard? Why you fester all this resentment toward others I don't know, but I truly find it sad seeing life is way too short to hold so much anger in ones heart.
As for you reiterating the statement that "closing the book on the holocaust" needs to occur, I can't fathom why someone with your views on the world would want such a thing. The history needs to be taught for many reasons, not just for the one noted above in my prior comment, but also to insure we as a society know most Germans weren't involved in any affairs relating to the holocaust. It sadness me that a recent poll in Europe revealed over 50% of children surveyed under the age of 18 weren't aware who Adolf Hitler was, which is exactly why the book shouldn't be closed.
Obviously reparations are a very controversial subject so I'll do must best to avoid the topic, but I'll say this; think about all that was stolen from these individuals whom are receiving them today, not the family members but the true victims....millions upon millions of reichsmarks, family heirlooms and anything else of any value such as their hair and shoes. **Please note I'm not saying reparations are right, but rather pointing out a theory of The possible reason they are given.
Finally, could you please point out where I labeled you as being anti Semitic. All I said was the context of your statment appeared to insinuate such ideas, never you, and that I could be interpreting inaccurately. I guess your true message was lost in translation, and I'm actually pleased to hear that. In fact, allow me to apologize for misinterpreting it. Moving forward now all I can say is let's just be grateful you and I only suffer minor prejudgements unlike the undesirables during the Third Reich, American Indians-African American slaves and so many others before us. We're truly blessed to live in this day and age.

[Weweslburg]

Dear Codycollector,
thanks for your statement and your kind words. Regarding the anti semitic thing, perhaps I misunderstood your first post. I just felt offended. Please understand that I of course - have the intention to defense my ancestors. I am as German have another sight than many foreigners, because I talked to so many old German people and I often learnt that the history was really written by the victors. The German people had been mostly described as beasts and Nazis, because they voted for the NSDAP. I know from many discussions, that especially the younger foreign generation has absolute now knowledge about German history, so the Weimar Republik and the third Reich. I know, why my grandparents have voted for Hitler and not again for the Communists, but this is another thing. Anyway, it is a fact that we Germans are meanwhile indeed bored as far as WW 2 and the Holocaust is concerned, because we have "daily" TV shows about Hitler, Göring, Stalingrad, Holocaust etc. We are getting vaccinated day by day by two TV stations. We daily hear that our grandfathers were beasts and brutal murders, but no one says that also the enemy, so especially the Russians have committed disgusting war crimes against German and Ukrainian soldiers. No one talks about that 15 million German "civilians" had been expelled after the war and that 3.5 million German "civillians" had been bestially tortured, raped and killed by Poles, Czechs and Russians. Do you understand what I mean ? Everything, the wole war is still pressed on German shoulders. How would you feel, if a foreigner would argue that all American Veterans are war criminals or that your Mother is a beast, because of the current war situation in Afghanistan (Guantanamo, US soldiers urinated in mouths of captives etc). No one has the right to offend your family, just because they eventually voted for a criminal like Bush or for Obama who daily orders drones to kill innocent people.

You mentioned that a poll was made and that less than 50 % of children or teenagers don´t have a knowledge about Hitler. I just want to ask you, how many European and US students know about the crimes committed by the Spanish and the Brits who enslaved 50 million people from 1550 to 1850, crimes, committed by Americans, Russians, Swedes etc. Do really all US children know about the slaughter on 1 million Indians ? That´s what I mean....these books had been closed a long time ago and therefore I wrote that the Holocaust book shall at least also be closed. None of your ancestors has slaughtered an Indian, so none of your family and generation is responsible and must defense itself. WE Germans, so our generation shall have an eternal guilt because of several mass murders, called Hitler, Himmler, Göring etc. I don´t know one single person in my environment who feels guilty and that´s good.

One last note: do you know that we Germans have paid the last "WW 1" reparation instalment to the USA on 3. October 2010 ? Now the next instalments for WW 2 are payable, so further - approx. - 500 billion European Euro ($ 570.00 billion), which means that our great-great grandchildren will still pay for world war 2, so Hitler and fellers will still be in German minds for the next 100 years or even longer.

It's common knowledge, even for the adult layman, that most German citizens during the epoch of the Reich weren't involved in the camps or the field killings of the so called "undesirables". I honestly don't know anyone-regardless of what country they're from-who thinks Germans having connections in their ancestry that are directly affiliated to the actions committed during the holocaust is the norm rather than the exception. Nonetheless, you made a transparent statement conveying that currently absolutely not one person in Germany has relatives who were involved with the Holocaust or turned a blind eye to it. Such a statment is quite false, and though the majority of individuals during the era were nothing other than honest, hard-working patriotic members of society, the Wehrmacht and other organizations, there are still plenty of exceptions to that rule, such as Heinrich Himmler's daughter, Gudrun Himmler.
I'm sorry you feel that all "us" foreigners offend Germans and "call them all Nazis" but not once in my life have I done that, publicly nor in the domain of my residents, granted I don't see the problem in calling a portion of the people who lived in Third Reich Germany Nazis considering that's exactly what many were during the period. It's no different, in my opinion, than calling a modern day American a Republican or Democrat. And is there any difference between your generalization of foreigners than all us foreigners supposed preconceived ideas of you all? Is that too not a double standard? Why you fester all this resentment toward others I don't know, but I truly find it sad seeing life is way too short to hold so much anger in ones heart.
As for you reiterating the statement that "closing the book on the holocaust" needs to occur, I can't fathom why someone with your views on the world would want such a thing. The history needs to be taught for many reasons, not just for the one noted above in my prior comment, but also to insure we as a society know most Germans weren't involved in any affairs relating to the holocaust. It sadness me that a recent poll in Europe revealed over 50% of children surveyed under the age of 18 weren't aware who Adolf Hitler was, which is exactly why the book shouldn't be closed.
Obviously reparations are a very controversial subject so I'll do must best to avoid the topic, but I'll say this; think about all that was stolen from these individuals whom are receiving them today, not the family members but the true victims....millions upon millions of reichsmarks, family heirlooms and anything else of any value such as their hair and shoes. **Please note I'm not saying reparations are right, but rather pointing out a theory of The possible reason they are given.
Finally, could you please point out where I labeled you as being anti Semitic. All I said was the context of your statment appeared to insinuate such ideas, never you, and that I could be interpreting inaccurately. I guess your true message was lost in translation, and I'm actually pleased to hear that. In fact, allow me to apologize for misinterpreting it. Moving forward now all I can say is let's just be grateful you and I only suffer minor prejudgements unlike the undesirables during the Third Reich, American Indians-African American slaves and so many others before us. We're truly blessed to live in this day and age.

[chrischa]

Weweslburg, your pm box is full.