Pz 1 in Norwegen

[PanzerAbt.Zbv40]

I was looking through some more press photos and came across this one. Is this a Panzer I? The caption reads as follows:

F3037/ German Panzer on an uninhabitable path.
Our picture shows the crossing of a railroad tunnel in Norway.
9 July 1940 Weltbild PK-Gebert

Now this one is hard. I have seen this picture someplace on the net before and have not been able to locate anything. Especially since there are no clear markings and the picture is taken, if correct, after the fighting ended.
Its a Panzer II c. Those mountains and the ravine suggest a place pretty far north from Oslo. When I soomed the picture, I saw part of a digit, 3 or 2 on the rear of the turret in the red and white versions of the 1st company. That company moved all the way up to trondheim, which strenghten my theory about the landscape.
I also buld model railroads, so i will ask around the model railroad community if anyone recognizes the tunnel/bridge.

I will find out. I'm stubborn.

[Todd Gylsen]

Your right. I never noticed the number before on the rear of the turret. Here is an enlarged scan. It appears to be a '2'.

[PanzerAbt.Zbv40]

Your right. I never noticed the number before on the rear of the turret. Here is an enlarged scan. It appears to be a '2'.

Yup. Thats why high resolution scans is the best. So you can zoom in and look for these things.
Then we atleast know this wagon belonged to the 1st Company.

[PanzerAbt.Zbv40]

Wow! Thanks for this information. Do you happen to recognize the second Panzer photo I posted?

Been working on it tonight.

[Akira Takiguchi]

Now this was confusing.. wish I could see that ebay pic. You didnt bookmark the auction page?

Unfortunately the auction is long gone...

I have alway thought the "famous" picture of NbFz 10 followed by a kl.Bef.Pz passing through downtown Lillehammer was taken right before the fightings north of that city. Therefore 10 was the only one taking part in that action and could be the only one blown up.

If this information is correct [only one was in Lilllehammer and was destroyed and it was "10"], it would lead to the conclusion that the widely accepted story - 1 mild steel NbFz was sent additionally to Norway after the loss in Lillehammer - is wrong.

The story is the very reason why I concluded that the photo was taken after the battle, thus, if you're right, 4 NbFz must have been sent to Norway at one time.

Are you sure that picture on ebay was taken after the battle? If this Faulbacher fell in Norway, the info is probably correct.

Faulbacher fell in 1940. The photos were printed at a photoshop in Oslo.

[MisterX]

Here is one dokument from the Pz Abt zbv 40

[Simon O.]

Here is one dokument from the Pz Abt zbv 40

great stuff!

Now, i'd really love to find a PAB doc or even better a complete grouping to this unit, i'm sure one will pop up one day.....one day.

[MisterX]

I also have the document to 1. Oktober 1938 with clasp

[Andrew Hall]

Faulbacher fell in 1940. The photos were printed at a photoshop in Oslo.

Akira, hope you are well. The inscription on 'your' NbFz says Feldw. Faulhaber 25.4.40

This corresponds (via the Volksbund) to 26 year-old Feldwebel Josef Faulhaber who fell on that date in Kvam (north of Trondheim) and is interred in Oslo.

Regards - Andrew

[PanzerAbt.Zbv40]

[QUOTE=Akira Takiguchi]If this information is correct [only one was in Lilllehammer and was destroyed and it was "10"], it would lead to the conclusion that the widely accepted story - 1 mild steel NbFz was sent additionally to Norway after the loss in Lillehammer - is wrong.

The story is the very reason why I concluded that the photo was taken after the battle, thus, if you're right, 4 NbFz must have been sent to Norway at one time.
QUOTE]

This get even more confusing. I thought they sendt 2 NbFz's as replacement. totally 5 all togheter..
But as I said, I have not concentrated much on the NbFz's in my research yet... lots of job to be done it seems.

[Akira Takiguchi]

Thanks Andrew for waking me up... By the way, the photos are not 'mine' but "sudek's" How I wish I had won the auctions.

May I ask have at least your first name, zbV40? Calling you by the unit's name is much confusing. We are here to talk very seriously about these matters... But anyway, I wasn't aware that both Nr.1 and Nr.2 were additionally sent, thank you (may be I had missed plural 's'?).

The said photos show only 2 NbFz. "10" and one prototype. It does not have frame antenna around the turret. The roundish turret was "covered" by new armor plates so that it looks much like that of Nr.3-5. M.G. turrets were original version.

[PanzerAbt.Zbv40]

I have located the place and backround of the picture. All my guessings was right.

[PanzerAbt.Zbv40]

Thanks Andrew for waking me up... By the way, the photos are not 'mine' but "sudek's" How I wish I had won the auctions.

May I ask have at least your first name, zbV40? Calling you by the unit's name is much confusing. We are here to talk very seriously about these matters... But anyway, I wasn't aware that both Nr.1 and Nr.2 were additionally sent, thank you (may be I had missed plural 's'?).

The said photos show only 2 NbFz. "10" and one prototype. It does not have frame antenna around the turret. The roundish turret was "covered" by new armor plates so that it looks much like that of Nr.3-5. M.G. turrets were original version.

My first name is Tom. Youre right, a nick can be somewhat unpersonal.
I have seen lots of other photos of NbFz's, so i will try get all the info I can about locatins, dates etc, so these things will be solved.
Btw, have you seen this page?
1934, 2 Prototypes. 1935, 3 Experimental Vehicles. I assume all of them went to Norway. 3 first and later 2.
http://www.wwiivehicles.com/germany/...euge_v_vi.html

[Leo]

The Neubaufahrzeuge...

Thanks Andrew for waking me up... By the way, the photos are not 'mine' but "sudek's" How I wish I had won the auctions.

May I ask have at least your first name, zbV40? Calling you by the unit's name is much confusing. We are here to talk very seriously about these matters... But anyway, I wasn't aware that both Nr.1 and Nr.2 were additionally sent, thank you (may be I had missed plural 's'?).

The said photos show only 2 NbFz. "10" and one prototype. It does not have frame antenna around the turret. The roundish turret was "covered" by new armor plates so that it looks much like that of Nr.3-5. M.G. turrets were original version.

Hi,

first of all, let me say hello and introduce myself as this is my first posting here. My name is Øyvind, 31 years old and I live in Norway. I have been following this thread with great interest as I have been collecting info and photos of german armoured vehicles in Norway for several years. The goal is to publish the results of this research some time in the future.

Regarding the Neubaufahrzeuge there must be some errors in what has been written in books over the years.

I believe I have photos of all the Neubaufahrzeuge sent to Norway. They are discernible by looking at the front of the vehicles about a week after their arrival.

To sum up some features:

no. 10 has a wooden plank across the glacis with some concrete blocks behind it.

no. XX has field modified add-on armour and is probably the one lost at Kvam. I have a photo of this near Lillehammer on 22 april 1940, and it is NOT the same tank rolling through Lillehammer with the Kl.Pz.Bef.Wg. I.

No. XX has no additional armour on the front plate, and has a Balkenkreuz beneath the small MG turret.

In addition I have a photo of one of the mild steel prototypes in Oslo, and the date written on the back of the photo says Oslo, 12.04.40.... if this caption is to be trusted at least one mild steel prototype was present at the same time or prior to the armoured ones arrived. But I have to investigate more on the matter.

After the campaign was over the NbFz were assembled in Oslo.
Mr. Takiguchi: I have the photos you talk about as well from earlier. Obviously more copies have been made...

In addition to the Feldw. Faulhaber inscription we are talking about, the mild steel prototype mentioned also has an inscription on the turret. This is commemorating Uffz. Lührig, who also fell at Kvam. The Ebay photo of this mild steel prototype was either taken prior to this text was painted on the turret, or the photo shows the fifth NbFz which also was a prototype. I am not 100% sure if there were 4 or 5 NbFz sent to Norway. I suspect one remained in Germany.

I will post some photos beginning of next week to elaborate a bit. And thanks to the photos of the Pz.II´s here the final turret numbers fell into place. I now believe that ALL the Pz. II´s, all the NbFz and 70% of the Pz. 1´s sent to Norway can be classified and identified by photos.

regards,

Øyvind

[PanzerAbt.Zbv40]

Hi,

first of all, let me say hello and introduce myself as this is my first posting here. My name is Øyvind, 31 years old and I live in Norway. I have been following this thread with great interest as I have been collecting info and photos of german armoured vehicles in Norway for several years. The goal is to publish the results of this research some time in the future.

Regarding the Neubaufahrzeuge there must be some errors in what has been written in books over the years.

I believe I have photos of all the Neubaufahrzeuge sent to Norway. They are discernible by looking at the front of the vehicles about a week after their arrival.

To sum up some features:

no. 10 has a wooden plank across the glacis with some concrete blocks behind it.

no. XX has field modified add-on armour and is probably the one lost at Kvam. I have a photo of this near Lillehammer on 22 april 1940, and it is NOT the same tank rolling through Lillehammer with the Kl.Pz.Bef.Wg. I.

No. XX has no additional armour on the front plate, and has a Balkenkreuz beneath the small MG turret.

In addition I have a photo of one of the mild steel prototypes in Oslo, and the date written on the back of the photo says Oslo, 12.04.40.... if this caption is to be trusted at least one mild steel prototype was present at the same time or prior to the armoured ones arrived. But I have to investigate more on the matter.

After the campaign was over the NbFz were assembled in Oslo.
Mr. Takiguchi: I have the photos you talk about as well from earlier. Obviously more copies have been made...

In addition to the Feldw. Faulhaber inscription we are talking about, the mild steel prototype mentioned also has an inscription on the turret. This is commemorating Uffz. Lührig, who also fell at Kvam. The Ebay photo of this mild steel prototype was either taken prior to this text was painted on the turret, or the photo shows the fifth NbFz which also was a prototype. I am not 100% sure if there were 4 or 5 NbFz sent to Norway. I suspect one remained in Germany.

I will post some photos beginning of next week to elaborate a bit. And thanks to the photos of the Pz.II´s here the final turret numbers fell into place. I now believe that ALL the Pz. II´s, all the NbFz and 70% of the Pz. 1´s sent to Norway can be classified and identified by photos.

regards,

Øyvind

That was some great info. Cant wait too see your pics.

yes, lots of errors have been writtn over the years.. Even in the newer articles about Panzers in Norway that are on several pages. Those articles are so full of errors, that they should be taken down at once. But I assume those writing them, have used book sources with the same errors.

tom