Krim Award Doc to Luftwaffe RK winner Otto Schultz

[mvm71]

I've had this award document in my collection for several years and was looking for it's approximate value on today's market. I have an idea but would appreciate some assistance.

The Krim shield award document is to Luftwaffe Ace and RK winner Otto Schultz.
Schultz won his RK in March 1943 while a pilot with JG 51. Schultz ended the war with 73 victories after more than 800 combat missions.

Despite the award doc having water stains which happended long before I owned the doc, the paper is solid and intact in every way.

Any help would be appreciated.

Thank you,
Mike

[mvm71]

Krim shield award doc........

[Ian Jewison]

Did Hauptmann Otto Schultz RK serve with 2/JG 51?????? I thought he served with II/JG 51 (i.e. 4 Staffel)!?

My initial impression of this document is not good I'm afraid!

Generalfeldmarschal von Manstein is signing as I.V. which is a representative of the unit......I wouldn't think so!!!

/Ian

[Hank C.]

Has the v. Manstein signature been compared to others? Either stamped or hand signed, I don't think this one matches very favorably....

Hank

[Simon O.]

I agree with Ian and Hank, another question, is this style of doc known to have been issued to members of JG51 or the LW in general?

[mvm71]

I have seen Manstein's signature/stamp on quite a few Krim/Kuban shield award docs.......one is on the e-stand right now.

I thought the type, paper, signature, and seal looked quite good to me.

More opinions would be helpful.....

Thanks,
Mike

Did Hauptmann Otto Schultz RK serve with 2/JG 51?????? I thought he served with II/JG 51 (i.e. 4 Staffel)!?

My initial impression of this document is not good I'm afraid!

Generalfeldmarschal von Manstein is signing as I.V. which is a representative of the unit......I wouldn't think so!!!

/Ian

[Simon O.]

Mike

Take a look around some of the dealers sites and compare this one with those they currently have up for sale. In particular look at the Manstein stamped signature and the date\ A.HQu. stamp used. Also see if you can find another example of this style of doc in use by the LW, preferably of course JG51.

Also, are you confident Schultz was with the 2 staffel at the time? I can't answer that i'm afraid, i only see that he was with the 4 staffel at the time of his RK.

[harmel]

Krim Shield

not pos on the authenticity of the award,but can say he was in 2/JG51,
and could have been a FW in 1942,as in March 1943 was an OFW when
he won his Knights Cross
Harmel

[mvm71]

Hi Harmel,

Yes, my research confirms this too!!

not pos on the authenticity of the award,but can say he was in 2/JG51,
and could have been a FW in 1942,as in March 1943 was an OFW when
he won his Knights Cross
Harmel

[Ron C.]

.

[mvm71]

I just observed this similiar Krim award doc on another thread......the other Krim doc looks very similiar...... Manstein printed/stamped signature, typed print, as does the eagle ink seal.

As I said, I'm no doc expert but until signifigant evidence proves otherwise I'd say my doc looks ok to me.

Just my thoughts on it.

Thank you,
Mike

[Simon O.]

The basic style of the doc is similar but that's about as close as it gets Mike.

1. That's an army unit not a LW. Need to find another JG51 Krim doc to compare styles issued to that unit.
2. The stamped sig is not the same (look at the . above the i and the way the sig begins), there is no i.v. on the bottom one
3. A. H.Qu. is stamped on the bottom one and not printed as on yours
4. The date is also stamped on the bottom one, not typed.
5. The font used on Generalfeldmarschall is also completely different.

[mvm71]

Good observations Simon, in your opinion would my Krim doc be a fake?

I have not yet found a Krim doc in this style for a Luftwaffe man so I have no others to compare to.

Your further opinion would be appreciated.

Thank you,
Mike

[Simon O.]

To be perfectly honest Mike, yes, i do think it's fake. I've seen a good few LW ones but none in that style, though in all fairness not to JG51. That type i've only seen to certain Heer units and all are like the inf.rgt.32 one.

If you take a look through some of the major dealer's stes you'll see a good cross section. Weitze for example currently has a Heer grouping with that style of doc as well as a few LW types including a grouping to a member of KG 55.

[TH0791]

This is not von Manstein's siganture, neither handwritten nor stamped.