WL Nachtjäger clasp, real???

[m-e-h-t]

Hi,

I got this clasp, looking for one to trade it for an dagger, so I have not much experience in these WL claspes. But I do not have a good feeling with it, the rivet is poor done.

Any opinions?

[m-e-h-t]

2

[m-e-h-t]

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[m-e-h-t]

4

[m-e-h-t]

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[AndyC]

This one was tricky
It has Steinhauer und Lück marking but i wonder if this one is a post war clasp.
I dont like the pin and catch on this one

I can offcourse be wrong so lets hear some more input on this one


Andy

[Ludwig]

IMO not original. Sloppy rivet, too.

[Thomas Durante]

Hi guys,

This indeed is a Steinhauer and Luck clasp. The reverse hardware is perfectly acceptable late war combination we see on other late war badges such as CCCs, etc (Fluted pin, sheetmetal hinge and flatwire catch on round catchplate). The finish also looks acceptable to me, I do like the glossy look of the black finish on the wreath.

But like Andy & Ludwig say, there is no real way to be 100% sure this is a wartime-produced badge or a post war S&L badge. Based on the sloppy cut of the rivet and the lack of finish on the arrow I would tend to think this is a post-war put together badge from leftover wartime parts.

This is a similar pattern we see with S&L's para badges, where there wartime badges have neatly domed rivets, but their post-war products often have crudely cut rivets that are just flattened. This isn't a 100% rule, just a general rule and no one can be 100% sure about S&L badges anyway in my opinion.

Tom

[Jos L C]

the lack of finish on the arrow I would tend to think this is a post-war put together badge from leftover wartime parts.

Hi Tom,

Certain R.K. nightfighter clasps also have "unfinished" arrows, I've one and have seen more ..

Jos.

[Thomas Durante]

Hi Jos,

Thanks for the information, I wasn't aware of that.

The muddies the water ever more on these S&L's then. I just don't know of a good way to tell the difference between a later-war zinc made S&L clasp and a post-war put together piece. Unlike most of S&L's other badges that use round wire pins, we have a good indication of post-war production in the "1957 scrape" that is on the pin:

http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...ht=1957+scrape

However, on these fluted pins we don't have such a feature to help guide us to know what is wartime and what is postwar IMO.

Tom

[Leroy]

... I just don't know of a good way to tell the difference between a later-war zinc made S&L clasp and a post-war put together piece.
Tom

Look at the finish. Their postwar "put-togethers" from original parts, unless using parts that were "pre-finished", never seem to have the kind of finish you would expect in late-war pieces, IMO. In the immediate postwar years, according to "stories", these pieces were not assembled and "finished" at the factory, but in private homes.

[Thomas Durante]

Hi Gentry,

I completely agree, I like the finish on this one and would suggest this is a wartime piece. These could also have been pre-finished parts that were assembled postwar, and that might explain why the clasp itself is finished, but why the arrow doesn't have any finish IMO.

Tom

[Thomas Durante]

Here is a 1957 fighter clasp from S&L, from LuckyLuud's excellent collection. The glossy black paint looks similar, if not identical to the clasp that started this thread IMO.

Tom

[Leroy]

IMO, the only clasps that you can be sure had the wreaths painted black
during wartime are the ones by R.K.

On all the rest, it is an educated guess and I would personally never pay more for a clasp with a black wreath, other than by R.K., than I would for one of equivalent grade that was unpainted.

[Thomas Durante]

That is a good rule of thumb Leroy

Tom