Winkler Pilot Observer

[Lorenzo Brown]

Here's a comparison of Winkler's badge on the left, and my own GWL PO on the right.
You can see the difference. On Winkler's badge there may be "hints" of the swirls, but if they are there they are not very deep.

[Jos L C]

It looks like these are quite easy to find in this condition lately..
I've heard SOS show also had a few of these etc..

Hmmm,let's wait and see..

Jos.

[Darrell]

Lorenzo,

You suggesting possible repaint job that's hiding the swirls? Or a reproduction where they are nailing the GWL stamping down to the flaw?

[Lorenzo Brown]

Not actually "suggesting" anything...but a conversion from a Pilot Badge to a PO is a real possibility given the absence of the swirls PLUS the non-dimpled rivets.

[Darrell]

Not actually "suggesting" anything...but a conversion from a Pilot Badge to a PO is a real possibility given the absence of the swirls PLUS the non-dimpled rivets.

ok thanks. makes sense.

[Larry Lipps]

Guys, that swirl pattern should be found on both pilot's and PO badges. Here's an example from both a pilot and PO badge. Sometimes it's hard to capture in a photo, but I'd be very hesitant to buy a badge that didn't have them.

[Marc Garlasco]

Jos,
I really think the old "there were a lot of X at the SOS this year" is a load of crap. I saw a couple at the bigtime dealers, but nothing that raised any eyebrows. Certainly not like the PAB fakes that have recently gotten so good. The GWL P/O has plenty of telltales for us...
Marc

[J Temple-West]

The non standard rivets alone would give me cause for concern, and that price I would certainly want an example that had had ALL the known characteristics of an original…wouldn’t you?

[Larry Lipps]

Of the four examples I saw at the SOS two had the correct rivets but no trace of the fingerprint pattern on the reverse. It's just a guess, but I think good, clear, photos of these rivets will indicate that they have a shallow dimple in the center. I guess what I'm saying is that even though a badge has dimpled rivets doesn't mean it will automatically have the fingerprint marks on the reverse of the eagle.

[Frank Heukemes]

I think this P/O is fine. The swirl is sometimes next to invisible like on this guaranteed original, not-messed-with pilot badge example:

[Frank Heukemes]

reverse

[Frank Heukemes]

only a very faint swirl effect, not even visible with the bare eye:

[skip]

I******180;d be sceptical about this as well.

It would******180;nt be so bad if it was just one point, like the swirls. But the fact that the rivets are also non standard would always give me personally an uneasy feeling.

Could be fine but when you laying down that sort of cash it should be "textbook"

Skip

[mmiller]

Well gentlemen,

I'm only the messenger so don't shoot me......... The badge has a new owner who reports the swirls are on the eagle reverse, and the rivets are dimpled. As mentioned earlier, the photography on the Site did not do the badge justice. Personally, for what nice GWL's are going for in the states, Kai's price was damn reasonable.

Mark

[VonStigler1]

sorry double post