Interesting
Interesting- Patrick have a nose for finding
nice items.
BR
Nicolai
Interesting- Patrick have a nose for finding
nice items.
BR
Nicolai
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Hi Patrick,Originally posted by Patrick W View Post
That’s good you found the date Junker was damaged and it answers my question but did production end then ?
Do we have any evidence?
I suppose now we must try and work out when the zinc badges were made
Kind regards ChayComment
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Hi Chay,Originally posted by upbeek View Post
Nothing's ever that simple.
Gentry's research at the U.S. National Archives in 2009 verified that the Juncker address at 13 Alte Jakobstrasse was totally destroyed on February 3, 1945 by American bombers:
https://wehrmacht-awards.com/forums/...29#post3492029
However, we don't know what damage or at least bombing pressures Juncker incurred with the British bombing raids prior to that date. And because of these earlier pressures it's quite possible they had already diversified to other addresses prior to February, 1945.
In 2016 Andreas Klein posted:
There have been no specifics posted about 1944 bombings and I don't know if Andreas has anything more detailed in his records but he further stated:Originally posted by Andreas Klein View Post
Originally posted by Andreas Klein View Post
Although there are no specifics there, the point is that anything is possible in terms of off-site retooling for more production under the Juncker name. Certainly Juncker was up and running in Berlin by 1950 at the Lausitzer Str. 31 address...with what, if any, tooling leftover from wartime we don't know.
If we accept the Minesweepers of Brill and Palmgreen at face value, it would appear that Juncker produced a 1st pattern diamonds badge before May, 1944 (when Raeder wrote to Brill's family) and a 2nd pattern diamonds badge sometime after July, 1944 (when Palmgreen received his Oakleaves). Again IF we accept the anecdotal evidence of these two awards, then in between the two, something appears to have forced Juncker to develop a new die for both the zinc and diamonds Minesweeper badges.
Best regards,
---NormLast edited by Norm F; 05-14-2019, 01:04 PM.Comment
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More Juncker evidence for the unmarked striated badges (as illustrated in post #18). That quote of Andreas regarding the close combat clasp got me thinking so I went over to the Heer forum to browse postings of Juncker CCCs.Originally posted by Andreas Klein View Post
Lo and behold, this so-called "3rd pattern" zinc Juncker CCC shows similar parallel grooves on the obverse! Quite exciting really, to see a similar process like this on a Juncker marked award.
Best regards,
---NormLast edited by Norm F; 05-15-2019, 10:45 PM.Comment
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Good spot Norm! I also found som evidence of similar marks on the equally scarce J4 pilot- look at the swaz on this one- you find these same lines to greater or lesser extent on others also, part of the die as opposed to filing.Comment
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Hi Patrick,Originally posted by Patrick W View Post
I really can’t see anything convincing on that low resolution photo. If you can find a higher resolution closeup then perhaps we can see.
Best regards,
—-NormComment
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Hi Norm
Sorry don't have any better pictures and don't own a J4- maybe someone who has one can have a closer look at the swastika and detail and see if the spiral cutting is present.
I don't think it was mentioned as such in the thread but the last pattern Juncker U-boat also has this clear spiral detail to the die cutComment
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Excellent confirmation.Originally posted by Patrick W View Post
Great consistency as a sign for late wartime Juncker production.
So a "working theory" is that these concentric grooves are seen on dies produced after bombing and/or wear had eliminated earlier working dies.
Best regards,
---NormComment
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It’s fascinating,
Juncker must have had some form of robotic Pantograph!
Kind regards ChayComment
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Here’s my zinc Juncker uboat it’s from a completely different die , has no striations but is a match mostly,
Kind regards ChayComment
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Hi Chay
Well that one should be from the same die- note the missing laurel leaf tip above the rear section which indicates this as the last die pattern. The pictures are a bit out of focus- can you have a look with a loupe and see if any trace of the striations in the same areas as on mine?
If they aren't there then we have a further puzzle and maybe a pre bombing and post bombing last pattern die!Comment
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Hi Patrick,
No striations, this is the best I can do,
I only have an iPad camera but you can see ,
Il add it has the pin scrape I never thought to check
Kind regards ChayComment
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Another thing to add the pin is not magneticComment
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Mystifying! Two zinc U-Boats, ostensibly the same variant, but with slightly different main pins and only one has the concentric striations.
Obviously two different production runs at least given the different pins, but the question is are they from two different production dies (one with striations) or are they from the same production die and there was some difference in how they were produced in terms of the pressure used and heating of the zinc planchet?
IF these striations are on the master die coming out of the reducing machine, perhaps going through the process of making a hub and production dies with hand finishing between steps can remove the striations by the time you get to the end product, and perhaps they were taking less care in eliminating those striations as time went on?
Regardless, so far we've seen these obverse symmetrical concentric striations only on Juncker or Juncker-like later production pieces and none that are early wartime.
Best regards,
---NormComment
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One of the most interesting threads I have seen in a long time. The rebirth of Juncker after the bombing makes one wonder if they made stuff after the war.
Thanks for a great thread guys!
Looking for a 30 '06 Chauchat magazine.Comment
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