Companies collaberating

[Don D.]

The problem is that Hr. Gottsteins span of experience doesn't include pre May 1945. We don't know if the company survived the war or not.
Don

[Don D.]

Like Robert mentioned in one of his posts AS in triangle may not have survived the war or is now a Czech company.

KR
Philippe

Pumping out those fake AS (triangle) badges no doubt.
Don

[Philippe DB]

Pumping out those fake AS (triangle) badges no doubt.
Don

Don please don't put any thoughts in my head. I often wondered where these many mint AS in triangle Bronze PAB's keep comming from. You don't think those crazy Czechs also found the old JFS IAB dies do you

I think we better plan that study trip just to take a look what the Czechs are doing there.

KR
Philippe

[Don D.]

You know Philippe, in the old East Bolck the East Germans and the Czechs were known for having the best quality goods (by eastern standards that is).
Now, if they inheritted the machinery, dies, etc... when they ran off the original owners then i can see them doing it. It would have been viewed as a joke against capitalism, I'm sure.
Don

[Philippe DB]

Hi Don,


I think we better stop thinking about this. Much to frightening as far as I'm concerned.

Like you say when the Germans were forced to leave Gablonz, they probaly weren't allowed to take their company infrastructure with them. On the site Skip provided the link to I just read that every German was allowed 30 kilos of luggage.

Well even if they would have been allowed to, they most likely wouldn't have taken their TR badges dies with them, would they.

And then for the Czechs that took over the place lock stock and barrel. How would these guys have reacted when they found all that Nazi production equipment. Would they have treasured it or would they have destroyed it just like they did with anything else featuring a swastika. I can only hope they did the later, the other option is to scary to consider.

KR
Philippe

[Indy]

I found 2 items made by A.D.Schwerdt. Hope someone has the same item...and hope there's a mm

http://www.dhm.de/datenbank/index.ht.../xx000190.html
http://www.dhm.de/datenbank/index.ht.../xx000753.html

[colin davie]

Don't know if I'm missing something, but why does Peter Seidel being not related to Adolf Seidel rule out Adolf for the mark AS in triangle? No-one has said Adolf Seidel only made glass and plastic

Also given what we have been told before about companies hiding 3R history how do you know we are being told the truth there is no relation between Adolf and Peter, those logos sure look pretty close to me.
C

[robert60446]

Hi Robert
Their company logo didn't change, they already were using it on their .A.S and A.S. PAB's
Like Skip was told by Hr Gottstein "Their logo is, and always has been A.S."

Philippe,
I was talking about Alfred Scholze GmbH. not Adolf Scholze. It is totally different company and the last candidate for AS in triangle explanation from Gablonz Association list.

[robert60446]

I think the key will be understanding what the triangle represents.
We have at least two makers that used it. What did it mean to them? Is this use of the triangle specifically German in any way? Or specific to an industry, trademark, etc....
Don

Don,
Triangle is specific symbol for jewelry makers. It is a symbol of diamond. Very often jewelry makers or jewelry stores are using triangle in their company logos...
Alfred Scholze GmbH company was created in 1939 by Alfred J. Scholze, with the aim of manufacturing costume jewellery. So maybe Alfred Scholze has something to do with AS in Triangle?

[Don D.]

Thanks Robert. Sounds like a possibility. If the triangle represents a diamond wouldn't the base be on the up side?
Don

[Philippe DB]

Sorry Robert, with all those Adolfs I lost track

Well I'm sure Skip will give old Alfred a call tomorrow morning

KR
Philippe

[robert60446]

Crosses of the Wehrmacht

Sorry Robert, with all those Adolfs I lost track

Well I'm sure Skip will give old Alfred a call tomorrow morning

KR
Philippe

Philippe,
"OK", it is more then 206 posts in this thread and i'm loosing my head as well! It makes me wonder how these guys from "Crosses of the Wehrmacht" section can talk about the die flaws on the RK for 643 posts in one thread...
Ps. Whatever will happen tomorrow, we cannot forget about the great discovery from today morning: Finally we have a proof for A.S. connection with Adolf Scholze company. Also discovery of Gablonz Association is a proof for company’s collaboration in badges manufacturing process. We are much smarter now, yet few questions still remains open...<O =""></O>

[Graeme]

Robert

I am sure you can put all the relevant info into a 5 minute movie clip for us

keep investigating, but always look for the proof.

regards

Graeme

[Dietrich Maerz]

Philippe,
That's "OK", it is more then 206 posts in this thread and i'm loosing my head as well! It makes me wonder how these guys from "Crosses of the Wehrmacht" section can talk about the die flaws on the RK for 643 posts in one thread...<?xml:namespace prefix = v /><v:shapetype class=inlineimg id=_x0000_t75 title=tongueout border="0" alt="" src="images/smilies/tongue.gif" o</v:shapetype>referrelative="t" path="m@4@5l@4@11@9@11@9@5xe" filled="f" stroked="f"> <v:stroke joinstyle="miter"></v:stroke><v:formulas><v:f eqn="if lineDrawn pixelLineWidth 0"></v:f><v:f eqn="sum @0 1 0"></v:f><v:f eqn="sum 0 0 @1"></v:f><v:f eqn="prod @2 1 2"></v:f><v:f eqn="prod @3 21600 pixelWidth"></v:f><v:f eqn="prod @3 21600 pixelHeight"></v:f><v:f eqn="sum @0 0 1"></v:f><v:f eqn="prod @6 1 2"></v:f><v:f eqn="prod @7 21600 pixelWidth"></v:f><v:f eqn="sum @8 21600 0"></v:f><v:f eqn="prod @7 21600 pixelHeight"></v:f><v:f eqn="sum @10 21600 0"></v:f></v:formulas><Vath o:extrusionok="f" gradientshapeok="t" o:connecttype="rect"/> <?xml:namespace prefix = o /><o:lock aspectratio="t" v:ext="edit"></o:lock><v:shape id=_x0000_i1025 style="WIDTH: 11.25pt; HEIGHT: 11.25pt" alt="" type="#_x0000_t75"><v:imagedata src="file:///C:\DOCUME~1\ROBERT~1\LOCALS~1\Temp\msohtml1\01\cli p_image001.gif" o:href="http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/forums/images/smilies/laughing.gif"></v:imagedata></v:shape><!--[if !vml]--><!--[endif]-->
<O =""></O>

it is possible...

Apart form that, I'm also looking into manufacturing connections in the Luedenscheid area and find this general topic highly interesting and most likely very productive in the end. German companies always had a tendency to work together, somehow...

Dietrich

[robert60446]

Thanks Robert. Sounds like a possibility. If the triangle represents a diamond wouldn't the base be on the up side?
Don

Good question Don. I don't know...but i have one more very interesting candidate for our AS in Triangle (maybe AS in triangle is not AS but SA in triangle!):
Schnabel Artur GmbH
Gablonzer Ring 49, 87600 Kaufbeuren-Neugablonz, Germany
Phone: +49 (0)8341 62206, Fax: +49 (0)8341 61375
Please read the whole company history:


1905 Foundation by Mr. Rudolf Schnabel at Gablonz/Neisse.
(Austrian-Hungarian Monarchy), Sudetengau. Mr. Rudolf Schnabel
specialized in producing hat ornaments, hunting jewellery and
tourist souvenirs of alpine character.
The town of Gablonz, famous for glass and imitation jewellery,
exports to 135 states all over th world.

1907 Move into our own premises at Gablonz

3.7.1914 Interruption by World War 1.

1919 After the end of World War 1. Gablonz belongs to the CSR
(Czecho-Slovakian Republic). Revival of business activity.

1922 Export to Germany, Austria and USA.

1933 Decline of exports due to foreign exchange management in
Germany.

1936 Foundation of an exportbranch at Gablonz and of a German
importbranch at Zittau/Sachsen (Germany) by Mr. Artur Schnabel
(second generation).

1.10.1938 Annexation of the Sudetengau by Germany.

1.9.1939 Beginning of World War 2.

21.5.1940 Mr. Artur Schnabel is called to join the army. His wife,
Mrs. Liese Schnabel, manages the firm until shortly before
the end of the war.

8.5.1945 End of World War 2.

1945 Explusion to Kaufbeuren.
A new quarter of this town, named Neugablonz arises on the site
of a former ammunition factory. This becomes the new homeplace
of the Gablonz people.

1946 New foundation of a factory at Neugablonz by Mr. Artur
Schnabel. He specializes in producing hat ornaments, hunting
jewellery, tourist souvenirs and costume jewellery as his
father had done.

30.6.1948 Currency reform.

1965+1974 Mr. Gerhard Schnabel and Mr. Wolfgang Schnabel enter the firm
(third generation).

1997 Internet with own homepage


1982 The firm Artur Schnabel GmbH is founded. The management is
taken over by Mr. Gerhard Schnabel (technical manager) and
Mr. Wolfgang Schnabel (commercial manager).


Today the firm has a wide programme and specializes in the production of metal

stampings, centrifugal castings and industrial hand-paintings. Great value is

attached to a life-like appearance. Modern techniques and first-class achievements

in production can compete with the international market.