Post-Crete jumps with weapons

[Heinz Steinkopf]

I spent 3 hours with a FJ veteran of the 4th FJD today. He told me they were trained to jump with all sorts of weapons. He stated you could jump with a k98k (no line attached) in your hands and just before landing you transferred the weapon to your left hand only, as you were supposed to roll over the right shoulder. You could also attach a 10 meter Bindelinie to the weapon and to your belt. After exiting the aircraft you dropped your weapon and held on to your line. Remember, he was only 17 at the time.

Thank you for your help. I appreciate it very much.
Still 10 meter cord is a little bit of exaggeration, I guess. It was more likely to be not more than 5 meters.
So, if the veteran is not mistaken, we can assume that it was a reality that Germans regarded parachute jumps in quite a weird way. It seems that they were far from usual German punctuality in this field. With the instability of descent on RZ parachute one could hardly guess over which shoulder he was going to roll.

[Greg Hamilton]

Thanks for the further information. Yes 10m seems a bit, especially as the few photos with lines don't show anything near 10m. But still a good data point from a vet. I bet there is more than that tidbit alone in a three hour visit!

[Willi Z.]

I will ask him again one day soon. It was a last minute question. I still can't find the video from the Sicilian campaign which shows some FJs in tropical uniforms descending with weapons hanging on their line. He does insist they were taught to roll over their right shoulder. In my limited number of jumps I do recall that a right rear PLF was my preferred method of landing, and I was able to accomplish that in almost all landings.

[Willi Z.]

Here is one photo I have which I just found again. One can see the Bindelinie attached to his MP and belt. Unlikely it is a 10-meter line.

[Heinz Steinkopf]

Here is one photo I have which I just found again. One can see the Bindelinie attached to his MP and belt. Unlikely it is a 10-meter line.

The more information we have, the more questions arise
Where was really the cord attached? Logically, it should have been attached to the harness rather than to the equipment belt. IMO, acceleration of a dropped MG42 falling 5 meters is not very compatible with the strength of a belt buckle. What do you think on this issue?

In my limited number of jumps I do recall that a right rear PLF was my preferred method of landing, and I was able to accomplish that in almost all landings.

What parachutes did you use?

[Willi Z.]

The more information we have, the more questions arise
Where was really the cord attached? Logically, it should have been attached to the harness rather than to the equipment belt. IMO, acceleration of a dropped MG42 falling 5 meters is not very compatible with the strength of a belt buckle. What do you think on this issue?


What parachutes did you use?

Good question. The photo appears to indicate the line (RZ20 canopy line?) was attached to the belt. I will ask the vet.


T-10, -1Bravo, and I think with the Bundeswehr we used a modified T-10. But I am not sure.

[Heinz Steinkopf]

Good question. The photo appears to indicate the line (RZ20 canopy line?) was attached to the belt. I will ask the vet.

It seems like. But it we can see that the rope is stowed under the belt and what looks like the point of attachment can just be a shadow of the rope itself. We need to check more pictures and possibly the veteran. I can imagine what he feels about all this technical details after 65 years.

And concerning the T-10. I have never used one but from the YouTube videos it feels like it is quite stable concerning the direction of the parachutist. In this case, as well as with, for example, Russian D-6, you can make a roll over preferred shoulder with a high lever of certainty. And we cannot say the same about RZ systems. We can see it on 1:55 of this video

[Willi Z.]

I preferred the -1Bravo which had the toggles to turn the chute. It has been a while though.......

Here is what the Bindelinie appears to be in my photo.

The FJ veteran has an extremely sharp mind for technical details. He was a mechanic for Junkers, converting He111s to jump mode, before he enlisted and became a Fallschirm Pionier. He then was drafted in the USAF during the Koren War, and then became a service manager for VW.

Obviously, I don't know from personal experience, but I suspect even with the RZ20 you could choose which shoulder to drop first and roll.

[Trebes]

Pre-Crete jumps with weapons

Hello.

Can someone explain what was the proper way to hold the weapon while exiting the aircraft? You can put an MP40 under your harness but what can you do with a K98 to ensure safe RZ opening and avoid any injuries upon opening which is quite hard?
And also is there any evidence of German paras jumping with weapons on Sicily or Ardennes?
I appreciate your help.

Your name suggests that you can read German.
Karl Heinz Golla: Die deutsche Fallschirmtruppe. Hamburg: Mittler, 2006, S. 190:
(when attacking Valkenburg airfield in May, 1940)
"Olt Schirmer hatte für das Mitführen der Maschinenpistolen beim Sprung am Mann eine Lösung gefunden, so dass die landenden Fallschirmjäger auch schon vor dem Aufnehmen ihrer Waffen aus den Transportbehältern über beachtliche Feuerkraft verfügen." - Nothing said about how they made it.

For those who cannot read German: Already in 1940 Lt. Schirmer had found a way to hold the MPs while exiting.

[Heinz Steinkopf]

Any new ideas?

[Spanish Freiwillige]

guys, I have a question, as I have been doing some research for a 1/6 diorama of the battle fo crete, I wondere if any FJ actualy jumped with weapons during this operation. There is a photo of a guy that straped his MP40 pouches to his legs and appears to have the MP 40 in his chest, but is these operation Merkure or a jump after??

just found the photo

[Heinz Steinkopf]

guys, I have a question, as I have been doing some research for a 1/6 diorama of the battle fo crete, I wondere if any FJ actualy jumped with weapons during this operation. There is a photo of a guy that straped his MP40 pouches to his legs and appears to have the MP 40 in his chest, but is these operation Merkure or a jump after??

just found the photo

I may be mistaken, but I see RZ16 harness and side-laced boots. So we can suppose this picture was taken somewhere not later than 1941.

[John Hodgin]

I may be mistaken, but I see RZ16 harness and side-laced boots. So we can suppose this picture was taken somewhere not later than 1941.

This photo is attributed to the Sturm Rgt. preparing for the Crete jump. Believe both RZ16s and RZ20s were used for Crete.

[Heinz Steinkopf]

This photo is attributed to the Sturm Rgt. preparing for the Crete jump. Believe both RZ16s and RZ20s were used for Crete.

I mean that RZ16 were seldom used after Crete.

[-Ray-]

It's unfortunate for the FJ's that a full combat equipment jump method was'nt exploited earlier. Based on the design of their harness and main chute, I believe this would have been more favorable for them compared to the U.S. paras that employed this concept for some of the following reasons:

-Once their chute deployed they had no risers or any manner of parachute steering control to bother with, basically had free hands dedicated to maintain the security of their weapons.

- No reserve parachute to tend to in any undue event. Also more room for a weapon/equipment.

I have seen a broken M-16A1 barrel first hand from the jump on Grenada "Operation Urgent Fury" with the
1-75 Rangers.
These weapons were jumped exposed with the PI on a concrete tarmac. That's what in fact happens in some cases as earlier mentioned.

During my career I instructed the JumpMaster Course and also had the opportunnity of an interior tour of both a Ju-52 and C-47. Those aircraft exits are very small unlike todays aircraft.

I never could understand their concept of jumping into a hot DZ without a primary weapon,,,,"screw that!"



-Ray-