Luftwaffe Wehrpass / Soldbuch of a KC holder

[peter u]

Thank Ian,

Rules and regulations!
He is not on the offical list so he is not an offical RK owner, simple.
I'am with you Ian.

He just forgot to mention his RK didn't went true the proper adminstrative channel. Somewere after 1958 it is being revoked.
Thus there are probabily not images of him and documentation of him wearing a RK in the 1960's.

I have seen it before but the otherway around, the RK awarded but not citated in the wartime wp, for example the wp of Albert Stecken that was sold several years ago.

This is for me the first time I have seen such a case like this one (of Lange being debated in this thread).

Very informative for me.

Cheers,
Peter

[Larry deZeng]

One quick point that has not yet been mentioned is the issue of motivation. If - and that is a very big "if" at this juncture - Lange himself faked the entries in his documents between 1945 and 1957, his motivation may have been his planned entry into the Bundeswehr. The "alte Hasen" from World War II were looked up to and admired by the younger officers and men, all the more so if they were DKiG awardees or RKTs. A zweites Weltkrieger entering in 1957 as a Hauptmann with the Ritterkreuz had a better shot at advancement than a contemporary who did not, provided all the other variables were pretty much equal. It was a leg up, as they say. The RKT had higher visibility that one who wasn't. Therein lies sufficient motivation to forge some documents.

I was there is the late 'fifties and I remember some discussions along this line with a U.S. Army major who belonged to a USAREUR liaison detachment assigned to the nascent Bundeswehr. The gist of the conversation was that some were doing this and it was well-known to the Bundeswehr but they were disinclined to do anything about it. So many of the surviving records were still in Allied hands at that time, that the Bundeswehr largely lacked the means to corroborate what applicants were claiming.

--BHS1956

[Sturmvogel]

DKiG

Hello all,

Thank you for your thoughts and comments.

In the Wehrpass all his "Leistungen" are mentioned and signed by Hovestadt. The last entry is from 1.5.45. That's the day when his duty with I./KG51 ended. According to the Wehrpass he then went to "Feldjagdabt. D. Lno. 103 (mot.)". The WP doesn't say when his duty with the Feldjagdabt. ended. However, the Soldbuch mentions that it lasted until 1 June (!). Afterwards, he served for another unit which I cannot identify. Seems to have been some postwar duty under (perhaps) US command? Since there is no "end" date in the WP, I conclude that the RK, DKiG, aerial victory, etc. entries were made by the Adjudant of KG51 (Hovestadt) on the 1 May 1945 when he left I./KG51.

The entry in the WP for the DKiG seems to have been

17.3.44 (and not 18.3.43)

The "7" was changed to 8 and the 4 in 44 overwritten by a "3" --> 18.3.43

Could it be that he was actually awarded the DKiG in 17.3.44? Does anybody have the list from spring 1944?

In 1943 and first half of 1944 he was an instructor with KG100, so he didn't fly any operational missions (which is confirmed by the flight log). Wouldn't it be strange that he was awarded the DKiG during this time? Or could it be that he was awarded the DKiG in retrospect after he flew operational missions again at the end of 1944?

It is indeed confusing.

I have attached a high res scan of the entries.

Regards
Roger

[Sturmvogel]

photo

photo

[Sturmvogel]

3

3

[Sturmvogel]

14. Fl. Div.

PS: Please not that the DKiG was - according to the WP - also issued by the 14. Fl. Div.

According to http://www.ww2.dk/air/hq/14fldiv.htm
the 14. Fl. Div. was only formed in 26.1.45 in Bersenbrück from parts of II. Jagdkorps. Support for Heeresgruppe H in Holland/Lower Reine.

The year for the DKiG award is either 1943 or 1944, but in that years the 14. Fl.Div. did not exist yet. So, it either seems to be an award in retrospect or done by Lange himself. Or was something like this common practise at the end of the war?

Regards
Roger

[Jaap Woortman]

Article about Huber Lange.

Roger,

In the 17th entrie in this thread you have mentioned that there was an article published about Hubert Lange " in the German magazine FLUGZEUG as well as - I think - in a British magazine (the same report translated to English). "
Was it Flugzeug Classic and do you know volume and number? Do you have this article and could you maybe send me a scan of it?

Jaap