just arrived today fallschirmjager enginer head

[Gary T]

What do you base the " There is absolutely nothing wrong with the FJ stamp." on

Donkey's years of experience.

[Chris Boonzaier]

Donkey's years of experience.

Oh... okay... must be right then

[Gary T]

Are we seriously considering that there is a functioning NCO school on mid march 1945 that needed a light flak gun Technician? According to Mehner most of these schools were disintegrating, men sent to fighting units, training areas overun by Russians etc. etc.

Every unit needs it's armourers. We have no idea what he was sent there for. But I bet it wasn't to be a paratrooper.

Why fake some no mark unit entry like that? Why not just pop in a FJR entry?

[Gary T]

Oh... okay... must be right then

Come on then...tell me what's wrong with it?

[Chris Boonzaier]

Come on then...tell me what's wrong with it?

For me its basically just a rubber stamp that could have been made at any time using ink that could have been made at any time. I always think that a stamp has to be explainable within the context of the group, not just because it "looks good", and you, being one of the guys who is usually on the same side of the fence as me in certain arguments would agree that the "donkeys years of experiance" argument is similar to the one used by dealers who get pi$$ed off when someone challenges their "years of experiance" when a high class fake turns up on their table.

I cede that he could have landed up in the school, but the following has to be taken into account... from 1938-March 1945 he was serving as a beaurocrat/Official/technician at the R.L.M., which has as much to do with the fighting army as the B.D.M.

I doubt that his expertise could of served any young NCO being sent to a hastily assembled Kamfgruppe on the frront.

At best it is an anamoly, his office was dissolved and he was pro forma, attached to a school that to all intents and purposes was no longer functioning, because they had nothing better to do with him.

I am sure you will agree that the entries are
1) Not completed
2) Do not jump logically from one to the next
3) are not ones where you can run your fingers down the entries and right away get a complete overview of his career.

I will revise my opinion and say, he probably DID land up in some bombed out school buildings with the remants of a staff... but none of it is logically followable in the documents, there are big jumps there... and I honestlydo not think this can be given the simply by looking at the stamp.

[Gary T]

For me its basically just a rubber stamp that could have been made at any time using ink that could have been made at any time. I always think that a stamp has to be explainable within the context of the group, not just because it "looks good", and you, being one of the guys who is usually on the same side of the fence as me in certain arguments would agree that the "donkeys years of experiance" argument is similar to the one used by dealers who get pi$$ed off when someone challenges their "years of experiance" when a high class fake turns up on their table.

Fair point. Apologies for short and sharp reply but working at the moment.

The stamp itself wouldn't have me suspicous on it's own...especially when there is another Fallschirm-Armee stamp in there. I would say this isn't ahigh end fake. I would be very surprised - and no offence to Doug - if ant FJ or gerneral doc collector would pay anymore for this item based on the presence of these two stamps. Indeed I think a LW collector would be more interested in the documents and the specialised nature of this man's work.

I cede that he could have landed up in the school, but the following has to be taken into account... from 1938-March 1945 he was serving as a beaurocrat/Official/technician at the R.L.M., which has as much to do with the fighting army as the B.D.M.

But we don't know his exact role...he could have been a paper pusher or a very knowledgeable expert on his weapons. Most of these schools only went into action when the Aliies\Soviets were within striking range...although I remember seeing something about them being dissolved in April 1945.

I doubt that his expertise could of served any young NCO being sent to a hastily assembled Kamfgruppe on the frront.

Again we don't know what he did exactly...he could have been a paymaster, the man in charge of the knives and forks or a technical expert.

At best it is an anamoly, his office was dissolved and he was pro forma, attached to a school that to all intents and purposes was no longer functioning, because they had nothing better to do with him.

Agreed...but where to send your technical men? Send them as a combat infantryman although they are not up to the job..or use their technical experience to train others?

I am sure you will agree that the entries are
1) Not completed
2) Do not jump logically from one to the next
3) are not ones where you can run your fingers down the entries and right away get a complete overview of his career.

All true but that doesn't condemn it as such...late war stuff is rarely complete or done in accordance with regulations.

I will revise my opinion and say, he probably DID land up in some bombed out school buildings with the remants of a staff... but none of it is logically followable in the documents, there are big jumps there... and I honestlydo not think this can be given the simply by looking at the stamp.

But the claim was that the stamp was bad...not the other issues. The stamp doesn't look bad to me. Of course without ink analysis etc none of us can prove it either way...unless Doug wants to write to WaSt and see what they have.

[Edward]

Hello Chris & Gary,

Both of you have raised some insightful points. I will have to revise my opinion though towards the stampings once again. My concentrating soley on the Fj school entry and the lack of an OKL seperations date it took Gary's reminder that on page 19 Doug had provided the other Fj stamping all along...duh! IMO, this second stamping with it's logical date does add weight to the first entry being correct. Yes, late war, but there are some legitimate descripancies that have been raised as well. As brought up a Wast records check will probably be the best way to go.

Best Regards

[douglynn]

thanks guys for a very interesting debate on this book