New arrivals from the bombed Zimmermann factory

[Robert T.]

Just one more post on this topic...

Member "Gew44" has posted on the "RK timeline" thread two pictures illustrating the manufacture of Iron Cross cores that could shed some light on the two-sided swords (shown below) manufacturing process.

The cores blanks are punched out from a strip of metal, the planchets are then struck between dies adding the face details. The process leaves a ridge on the outer contour of the cores that will be later trimmed.

Robert

[marisca lrommel]

This piece from the same factory Zimmerman I have in my collection.

Was the order of the German Eagle manufactured only by GODET as only manufacturer authorised... then... who made this piece at the burned factory of Zimmermann?

The order of the German Eagle 3rd class was being manufactured in silver, however this other is made in copper or bronze...











Does Zimmermann helped Gore in the production of orders of the Eagle?

Is it a prototype?

It is a piece of evidence to be presented to a contest in order to obtain approval for their manufacture?... I'm afraid we'll never know: Uhoh2 Confused:

[Peter J.]

This most valid question by M. was raised more than 2 years ago, effectively killing the thread. So what do you guys say about the bronze produced "Zimmermann" DAO's? And what about the alleged Rath produced Sonderstufe on Thies's next auction? We now have 4 candidates for DAO instead of previously two

cheers
Peter

[streptile]

Hi Peter,

Aren't bronze-gilt DAOs quite common? I've owned one myself (see attached), marked 21. And the piece is made by Zimmermann, but so were all Gebr. Godet DAOs in my opinion.

To be honest I think the question was ignored because it's off-topic and has no new information in it...

[Peter J.]

Hi Trevor,

Well, I haven't ran into a gilded bronze DAO, so as for common I wouldn't know. I assume your cross is void of any silver stamp, something generally seen on "Godet" pieces with my limited experience. My spontaneous question would be: why would there be a bronze version at all for Germany's only diplomatic Order?

I know it's off topic, but it's a piece of the puzzle. The three initial questions brought forward at the beginning of this thread related to the discovery of this find, are we all content?

I mentioned the Sonderstufe on Thies's auction, due to the EXTREME rarity of this decoration. Now I've been told one piece was previously also offered at Hermann Historica. Don't know how the latter was marked, Thies's is allegally made by Rath! Am I really the only one that find this remarkable?

cheers
Peter

[streptile]

Hi Trevor, Well, I haven't ran into a gilded bronze DAO, so as for common I wouldn't know. I assume your cross is void of any silver stamp, something generally seen on "Godet" pieces with my limited experience. My spontaneous question would be: why would there be a bronze version at all for Germany's only diplomatic Order?

Hi Peter,

Yes, there is no silver stamp. Not sure how common they are but I've seen quite a few bronze-gilt DAOs. I imagine they switched to bronze for the same reason the Third OHL switched from gold to silver-gilt in 1916: money.

As for the Thies piece, I'm not sure what it is or how he knows who made it, but it's very nice, and gold. Love to have one of those. I believe Thies sold this piece, or another just like it, a few years ago as well.

[streptile]

Thies Auk. 44 Los 267.

Also included was the Star (pictured in catalogue).

[Euronymous]

When was C.F Zimmermann bombed ?

[BassD]

can not say when Zimmermann was bombed first. But for sure they are totally bombed out on 23. Februar 1945.

Will check my files when i am home.

[Andreas Klein]

Zimmermaann was located in the heavily bombed middle part of Pforzheim. The desctruction map of Pforzheim shows an amount of destruction of 80% and higher. Wikipedia names the level of destruction with 98%.

Official RAF reports wrote:

„The attack on the night of 23/24 FEB 1945 has reduced the buildings in the greater part of the town to hollow shells or heaps of rubble. Most of the identifiable factories, including seven of priority 3 rating, have been destroyed or severely damaged.“

Video Link

Video Link 2

[Euronymous]

Then one thing is for sure: They didn't make any medals after the bombardments !

[marisca lrommel]

Hi Peter,

Yes, there is no silver stamp. Not sure how common they are but I've seen quite a few bronze-gilt DAOs. I imagine they switched to bronze for the same reason the Third OHL switched from gold to silver-gilt in 1916: money.

As for the Thies piece, I'm not sure what it is or how he knows who made it, but it's very nice, and gold. Love to have one of those. I believe Thies sold this piece, or another just like it, a few years ago as well.

They were never to make DAO's bronze with silver plated.

ALL the orders of the Eagle German were made in silver with quality 835 or 900 except the medal in bronze.

Which I presented is a rare model whose purpose I know...

[streptile]

They were never to make DAO's bronze with silver plated.

Perhaps that's true, but I've seen (and owned) bronze gilt DAOs.

[marisca lrommel]

Perhaps that's true, but I've seen (and owned) bronze gilt DAOs.

If you've seen DAO's bronze with gold bath, these DAO's are 100% FAKES

All 3Rd, 2Nd, 1St, Order with Star, Grand Cross are made in SILVER with Gold bath.

Medals silver version are made in silver (1937-1943 period) or zinc with silver bath(1943-1945)

Medal bronze version are made on bronze or zinc with bronze bath(1943-1945)

[streptile]

If you've seen DAO's bronze with gold bath, these DAO's are 100% FAKES

OK, I'm no DAO expert. Mine looked okay to me, but I've sold it on already, to someone at a show, so I can't check it anymore.

Just one question: How do you know there were no bronze-gilt DAOs?