please help with EK1.

[streptile]

Ok ... I'll bite ..show me where L15 has been deemed Orth.

Hi Darrell,

HERE is one thread in which it is summed up a bit.

The basic issue is that L15 crosses look exactly like Orths. Exactly. Every part the same. And they have no resemblance to Schickles.

[Darrell]

Hi Darrell,

HERE is one thread in which it is summed up a bit.

The basic issue is that L15 crosses look exactly like Orths. Exactly. Every part the same. And they have no resemblance to Schickles.

Trevor thanks for the thread. However, seems to be alot of "speculation", "theory" "someone claims" .....

I prefer to use Dietrich's logic. Lets find period proof before we start stating gossip and unfounded rumors as "truths". In fact it was just a few months back Dietrich finally found period proof that L/15 was in fact Schickle. Not the host of other manufactures that rumors and theories had listed.

QUOTE*

I know there is some controversy about exactly who made this cross. The theory I am most comfortable with is that this one was made by Friedrich Orth, who had a PKZ no. of '15'. While Otto Schickle had an LDO no. of 'L/15', he also went out of business at some point (1942?). This cross looks a lot like known Orth EKs marked '15', but is marked 'L15' as can be seen (no / between the letter and the number). The theory is that Orth could added an 'L' it to his PKZ no. '15' sometime after Schickle's demise. Why the manufacturer would do this is unknown. Also unknown (well, to me) is whether this was in any way authorized.

There is also some anecdotal evidence that this was made by Orth: someone claims to have found a batch of these 'L15' marked EK1s outside the old Orth factory near the end of the war, if I recall correctly.

UNQUOTE*

Personally I'd be very leary of anything stamped L15 regardless of the core or frame.

I've seen them on L15 (Floch), L15 (the one posted here) and the L15 that was posted here:

http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...d.php?t=362279

Seems someone liked using the same stamp for a wide variety of crosses, 2 of which are fakes. All in Herr Floch'es or Souval's neighborhood. Postwar? .. that's my theory.

[streptile]

Hi Darrell,

I don't really disagree with anything you've written, and I hope I was careful in the other thread to distinguish established fact from speculation at every turn. Yes, it's a theory that Orth had a hand in these crosses, not a fact. And yes, the similarity between the L15 stamp in question and the one on indisputable Flochs makes me very uncomfortable, too... But let's also be careful, using your same standards, not to cast doubts on a cross that is currently an accepted original wartime piece without some hard evidence.

I think this is a mystery that will continue... until it's solved. Now, is that deep or what ?

[Wik]

Hey guys, kinda bumping this thread for the info as I had a question.

I saw a very nice cased "L15" marked EKI pinback. I was trying to confirm it without having to nag others about possible originality so I did a search here. Saw all the speculation between L/15 and L15 maker's mark.

Is the argument (friendly argument anyhow hahah) basically that one group of collectors believe them to be Otto Schickle and the other believe them to be Orth?

Interesting about the Flochs as well. Didn't realize so many had the L15.

Out of curiosity then, how rare are L/14 crosses? If this was Orth's LDO number but they switched to L15 after Schickle's demise (which has been pinned around late '41-'42 from what I understand) wouldn't that give the L/14 marked crosses a very short production time, thus (in theory anyhow) making them a more rare cross, at least as far as the MM?

I believe Stefan posted a L/14 SB, but do most of you guys have L/14s in your collection as well? I admit I have never been aware of this little debate so I have never really looked out for L/14s before but I can also say that I don't recall ever seeing one in passing either.

Just curious as to where this leaves not just Schickle's crosses (as many people have said L/15s are rather tough to find) but also Orth's apparently (or at least possibly) very short L/14 marked production time.


Ryan