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Did Juncker make a Schinkel Iron Cross?

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    #46
    Originally posted by 5tefan View Post
    OK, good points for you both Ben and Trevor

    Ok but let me ask two more question.

    EK2 B-Schinkel and Half-Schinkel is clear! B-Schinkel and Half-Schinkel has nothing to do with WW2 frame form!

    And AWS has use the WW2 frame form for EK2 1870 and EK1 1914 pre 1918.

    It's seems that AWS was the only maker who use the 1939 frame form before1918!

    But what has AWS to do with Juncker?

    Maybe my question will give us more details about the Juncker Wide Frame 1939 Version!

    Can someone show us a 1914er Junker WW2 Edition and 1914er WW1 Edition with Juncker Wide Frame to compare it with the Juncker Wide Frame 1939?

    Trevor, no doubt it is a very good and very interesting thread and I like to get the needed evidence to it and maybe all of us can benefit from my annoying statements or questions
    There are some early 1939 Juncker crosses with 2 piece SB that have AWS parts.
    I haven't really studied them, but AWS and Juncker had some kind of co-operation on ek's.
    I don't have a link at hand, but I can post some pics tomorrow.

    Best regards,
    Ben

    Comment

      #47
      Ekii

      Interesting discussion. Here is my EKII Juncker Schinkel wide-frame.
      Measurements:
      Hight: 43.97 mm
      Width: 43.76 mm
      Weight: 18 g

      Jim
      Attached Files

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        #48
        Hi Jim ;-)

        nice Juncker EK2 1939.
        Do you have a Juncker 1914 Variant with the Schinkel wide-frame? Not an AWS! A Juncker 1914 with Schinkel wide-frame!
        That would affirm this definition of "a 1939 core in pre- 1918 frames used for 1914 EK1! = Schinkel".

        Comment

          #49
          Originally posted by 5tefan View Post
          Hi Jim ;-)

          nice Juncker EK2 1939.
          Do you have a Juncker 1914 Variant with the Schinkel wide-frame? Not an AWS! A Juncker 1914 with Schinkel wide-frame!
          That would affirm this definition of "a 1939 core in pre- 1918 frames used for 1914 EK1! = Schinkel".
          Stefan, I don't collect 1914 crosses, so no I do not have one. Jim

          Comment

            #50
            Originally posted by 5tefan View Post
            Hi Jim ;-)

            nice Juncker EK2 1939.
            Do you have a Juncker 1914 Variant with the Schinkel wide-frame? Not an AWS! A Juncker 1914 with Schinkel wide-frame!
            That would affirm this definition of "a 1939 core in pre- 1918 frames used for 1914 EK1! = Schinkel".

            I don't collect 1914 ek's either, but I really don't get the problem?

            The frame goes back to , at least 1914 (check page 1) and returns in ww2 with a 1939 core.
            So it's a 1914 (at least) frame with a 1939 core = Schinkel.

            Or, let me put it like this.
            Do you consider an S&L , marked L/12 as a Juncker or as an S&L
            Same goes for W&L prodced L/12 crosses...

            ben
            Last edited by ben bijker; 04-01-2012, 05:04 PM.

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              #51
              Originally posted by ben bijker View Post
              I don't collect 1914 ek's either, but I really don't get the problem?

              The frame goes back to , at least 1914 (check page 1) and returns in ww2 with a 1939 core.
              So it's a 1914 (at least) frame with a 1939 core = Schinkel.

              Or, let me put it like this.
              Do you consider an S&L , marked L/12 as a Juncker or as an S&L
              Same goes for W&L prodced L/12 crosses...

              ben
              Well this cross here is the cross that is stated to have been in use around the 1890s and years prior to WWI.



              This is the same frame that is used for the Imperial era crosses as well and then later the very early Juncker crosses that have been highlighted in this thread.


              Ryan

              Comment

                #52
                maybe it is a good time to refresh this thread

                http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...=1#post5530377

                Comment

                  #53
                  Hy Stefan ,,,interesting .


                  what an contradiction between imperial way of looking at Schinkel designs and the way 1939 collectors looking at the Schinkel design

                  I found this thread by a chance and I can only say you are absolutely correct .

                  In imperial the Schinkel is defined already very very clearly and the AWS or juncker seing as a Schinkel frame would be strange indeed .

                  maybe defining a wide frame imperial style would bring some light here.
                  http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...d.php?t=714193



                  define a wide frame and you know what a Schinkel is
                  regards kay
                  Last edited by Montgomery Burns; 01-16-2014, 04:43 AM.

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