HOW to determine pre/post S&L!

[Harry]

Good man Tom,

What I was puzzled by was the fact that this row of dots is on the 2nd 800 marked cross that I have posted, but not the first! even though the first cross would be considered the later cross, if judged by finishing on the 'eye' and the ribbon loop ends!

[Bob Hritz]

Harry,


To my eye, the dent row is visible on both 800 marked crosses, although very faintly. On the first, heavily frosted cross, you can barely see the tiny dents on a few of the raised ribs.

All of this has me thouroughly confused.
Bob Hritz

[Dietrich Maerz]

Harry,

thanks for posting! And yes, I agree, both A-Types and no dent row at all.

I just could look today at another B-Type, nicely frosted, un-marked and the dent row is clearly visible, as is the knee flaw. And the ring is half-finished...

Dietrich

[Bob Hritz]

I am so hopelessy confused. I see dents, but there are no dents. Perhaps I just don't understand exactly what I am looking at???? Are the dents on the "B' type on the underside of the 3 O'Clock arm, approaching the lower point?


Bob Hritz

[Dietrich Maerz]

Bob,


no need to get confused. The dent roe is at the lower inwards going 3 o'clock arme and look like this - heavily magnified, of course. This is a 935-4 in the early stage
Once you have seen it you cannot mistaken it anymore.

Dietrich

[Dietrich Maerz]

... and here on a 1957 non-swasika S&L. It's alreadu a little less pronaunced but still clearly visible.


Dietrich

[Dietrich Maerz]

... and here on an unmarked, unmagnetic swastika cross from S&L

[Dietrich Maerz]

Once you know how it looks and where to look, you can even spot it on pictures on some dealers sites. This is a "935"


Dietrich

[tom hansen]

Once you know how it looks and where to look, you can even spot it on pictures on some dealers sites. This is a "935"


Dietrich

So what happened to that line of "dot" flaws on the lower part of the 3 oclock arm from type "A" to type "B"?

[Dietrich Maerz]

So what happened to that line of "dot" flaws on the lower part of the 3 oclock arm from type "A" to type "B"?

You know my opinion...
But actually it doesn't matter. What's important is that one can clearly identify and differentiate A- and B-Type.

Dietrich

[Dave Kane]

Dealer offered as an EARLY, pre '41 cross! Non magnetic core, plated brass frame and silver frosting. How could this be?

[tom hansen]

Here is another photo of the "dots" that Harry has mentioned at the bottom of the 3 oclock arm.

[tom hansen]

Here is the bottom of the 9 oclock arm

[George Stimson]

Post # 101

Dave, what makes the dealer think that that's a pre-'41 RK? Does it have some provenance?

[Dietrich Maerz]

Dave, what makes the dealer think that that's a pre-'41 RK? Does it have some provenance?

What makes the dealer think?

- it's w/o doubt Steinhauer und Lück!
- non-magnetic core
- non silver rim

So it must be early, i.e. pre-LDO. It's that simple!

And that's exactly why some people will fight the identified die features tooth and nail with all their 'weight' as a knowledgable dealer. Confusion will reign, ridicule will be the main argument and peole will have nice collections of early S&L. Thre are currently more early then late ones on the market, btw. Contrary to the award numbers! And no provenance!

But hey, that's just a minor inconvenience in historical facts.

Dietrich