RK question

[vic007]

Hello

A quick question:

Is this a Deumer RK?
What would a fair price be for such a 2nd pattern RK?

Thank you in advance
Best regard

stijn

[ekhunter]

Mho

Just my two cents, but I would say no to it being a Deumer.

[Matthieu]

I can tell you a few things about this one, Stijn ...

1. I like it .
2. If you dont want, I'll buy it for sure .

And thats all I can help you with, I'm afraid .

[Seewolf]

aaah, great we can discuss this style of RK. I really don´t know who can be the maker but i´ve seen a few of them (only at pics). They are all 3 piece with a magnetic core and look surely well done. What i don´t like on these ones is the area at the outer corners which i marked. Looks like worn but i´ve seen that at all those RK´s. There´s no frosting at all and no good polished frame.
Is there a TR EK maker who has the same characteristics at the beading??
IMO a good made later ( 70´s) production, but who made it

As the maker is unknown, i would pay max 150€ - 175€

I know the seller wants 300€ - but that´s too much

[Matthieu]

As the maker is unknown, i would pay max 150€ - 175€

I would have paid more then that ... but thats just me being .

[Seewolf]

I would have paid more then that ... but thats just me being .

Always these rich Belgians

[Matthieu]

Always these rich Belgians

How do you know I got my paycheck today, Rüdiger ? You really must have some psychic powers .

[ekhunter]

???

This cross looks very similiar to a cross that was discussed on GMIC before. I believe it was discussed about a year ago, and I'm not sure if there was any conclusion as to the maker of the RK actually was . Also, I personally like the cross.

[vic007]

Thank you all for your input.
Indeed Rüdiger, i thought it was wear on the corners but since it is the first time i see this type i haven't anything to compare it with.
If you have seen this on all the RK of this type, that is either not a good sign or either it is a die feature.

On SDA there is a link between this design and Schickle design. And it would have been Deumer that has used the die and produced this type.
On page 150 of Maerz's RK book i see similarities with the innercorners of this design. However this is a later design because of the dipped ring. So i'm still not 100% certain this can be linked to Schickle.

Maybe other members can shed a light on this one?

Best regards

stijn

[Seewolf]

As i wrote before i like this cross too. But IMO this is more a 70s, maybe late 60s production judging by the finish of the frame. But i don´t like the points i marked, don´t know really why. All (not much) crosses i saw, had the same points as i marked. On the backside the outer corners look the same.

I know the first owner from my german forum, he said he bought this one in the 60s at the "Kleiderkasse der Bundeswehr", but who knows, did he tell the truth or did he forgot the real date of buying? The 60s can also be 1969.

[Seewolf]

Or another question..has anyone seen or a pic of a Deumer RK ?
I always hear and read about them, but i haven´t seen one yet

Where is the evidence that Deumer made RK´s

[DavidM]

Hello

I believe this RK is made by S&L from the late 1980's onwards. I base this on having had two late made RKs which were identical in both the frames and cores to this one - and one of them came to via a dealer directly from S&L in 1989.

See this thread for details of one of them:

http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...d.php?t=237843

The other also originated from S&L, but was a later made (1990's) piece with oaks - all in all a really poor piece, as can be seen in the attached photo!!! But, both RKs came from S&L, hence my statement.

Regards
David

[Nigel N]

Hi Stijn, Deumer made some very nice 57 EK1 & 2's, but i dont think they made RK's, as far as i know, only S & L and Schickle made 57 RK's, there are one or two RK's using wartime frames and new form 57 cores, Klein & Quenzer is one example i've seen!
I think this has got to be S & L, but, like Rudiger i dont like the worn outside corners, reminds me too much of the Morigi fakes, with their inside corners that have no beading detail!! But i think this ones ok, but i would'nt pay that much for it!!hihi.gif -Nigel

[DavidM]

Hi Stijn, Deumer made some very nice 57 EK1 & 2's, but i dont think they made RK's, as far as i know, only S & L and Schickle made 57 RK's, there are one or two RK's using wartime frames and new form 57 cores, Klein & Quenzer is one example i've seen!
I think this has got to be S & L, but, like Rudiger i dont like the worn outside corners, reminds me too much of the Morigi fakes, with their inside corners that have no beading detail!! But i think this ones ok, but i would'nt pay that much for it!![ATTACH]1338170[/ATTACH] -Nigel

Hello

The Morigi connection is interesting (see my earlier post, #12) but none the less these new form RKs are from the late 1980's onwards and are by S&L. The one that I got through Morigi most definately came direct from S&L in 1989.

Just for the record, here's Morigis latest 57 RK offering (sorry the picture isn't that good, it's the best I could make it).

Regards
David

[Nigel N]

Thankfully it looks like Morigi has'nt improved his RK's!!
Still the missing detail on the inside corners, date font is too skinny, and acorns have no details to cups..hope he's not reading this