57 Ribbon Bar

[mburden]

hi i came across these and i've never seen a 57 ribbon bar before is it legit ? i would imagine it is but just asking

[George L]

Looks ok to me, but I don't know the difference on these between cobbled together, and legit ones. Hopefully, some of the regulars on here can comment.

[mburden]

Or How about this one ?

[mburden]

Any one ??

[Okrach]

If You asked me I would say these are recently made pieces ...of junk

[Scott C.]

They look like nice bars, but as George said, it's hard to tell the "originality" of a '57 bar as they are easy to put together. Most originals I've seen from veterans have a red (felt?) backing with a thin horizontal pin. I like your first one more than the second; the age of the first looks consistent and the awards are plausable. The quality of the second bar looks a bit sloppy and the KVKII ribbon is in the wrong position. Bottom line: unless you get it straight from the veteran, there's a chance it's been put-together for the collector market.

EDIT: After looking at both bars again, I have to agree with George and Tomasz - both look like collector "put-togethers."

[Okrach]

... unless you get it straight from the veteran, there's a chance it's been put-together for the collector market.

Indeed. IMO these are are not original

[speedytop]

Hi,

it is not really important, when these ribbon bars were made. I think, they were always original.
There were no regulations in the German "Ordensgesetz" from 1957 about such bars.

You can e.g. find regulations in the German Army, the Bundeswehr.
In the "ZDv 37/10 Anzugordnung für Soldaten der Bundeswehr"

The both bars here fulfill the Army regulations, when the discrete bar have the dimension of 25mm x 12mm. It seems, as if that is so on these two bars.
They are correctly arranged, the fifth bar below the first, and the ranking is nearly correct, only on the second bar the General Assault Badge and the Wound Badge must be changed, but the KVK II is correct previous to the Ostmedaille.

And therefore please explain me, why these two bars are "junk"?

We can discuss about nice and ugly bars, about old bars from the 50's and the 60's and recently made pieces, but not about originality, if they fulfill the Bundeswehr and e.g. police etc. regulations.

I know, that some persons here, but not only in this section, have problems with me, the bloody f.. Uwe (speedytop), but i can live with it .

If someone can convince me, that I am wrong, no problem. But, please, with strong arguments.

And now a bar for your judgement, especially about originality



Kind Regards
Uwe

[mburden]

here are the uniforms they are on

[mburden]

and the other one

[Scott C.]

Well, if the bars are original to the tunics, and the tunics can be traced to their original owners, then I guess I have to eat some crow .

[speedytop]

Hi,

I have forgotten something.

We can and must talk about authenticity.

But there were thausands of possible combinations, and we can only look for plausibility.

If there is a uniform, it is better to appoint.

Can I date the jacket?

Often you can find post WW II decorations on such bars, particularly for higher ranked soldiers like a colonel or a general.

A late jacket for higher ranked soldiers without post war decorations could be suspicious.

Therefore, the second bar on the later/newer jacket, i miss the oakleaves on the shoulder boards, could, but must not be suspicious. Both iron crosses and both KVK, that is uncommon.
Here we must talk about authenticity.

Regards
Uwe

[Jimmy]

How about this one?

How about this one?

[Jimmy]

2

2

[landsknechte]

I can't quite tell from the picture... Are the tank destruction badges gold or silver?